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00:54:22  <ryancole>hi all, on windows there's an issue with process.c's quote_cmd_arg, i think.
00:54:37  <ryancole>empty params are not properly quoted, theyre skipped. i think they should instead be double quoted.
00:54:56  <ryancole>i have pull request with what works better, i think: https://github.com/joyent/libuv/pull/1266
00:55:51  <ryancole>right now, if we pass an empty arg from node through child_process' spawn method, we lose it in libuv
00:57:21  <ryancole>this kind of fks up ther arity if an app expects 3 args, and the middle one is empty, etc.
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01:10:46  <ryancole>heres a question: on Windows, how can i debug a specific unit test? i can run them, but breakpoints dont seem to break using the runner
01:10:57  <ryancole>trying to add a test for this pull request of mine
01:11:00  <tjfontaine>run-tests.exe test-name test-name
01:11:03  <ryancole>need to debug
01:11:06  <ryancole>k cool
01:11:08  <ryancole>ty
01:11:14  <tjfontaine>will prevent it from doign a fork for it
01:11:20  <tjfontaine>runt-tests.exe test-name
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01:11:23  <tjfontaine>will do a single fork
01:11:35  <ryancole>k cool
01:13:49  <ryancole>sweet that works, nice.
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01:31:56  <ryancole>not sure i comprehend the unit test entirely, but i did add an empty string to the quote_cmd_arg inputs and it seems to pass, still. although i dont know how strict of a check that is.
01:32:50  <ryancole>wonder if itll fail if i remove my patch. ill try.
01:35:04  <ryancole>hm might be tricky to explicitly test because maybe CommandLineToArgvW interprets the quotes
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04:50:53  <danby>Is there anyone here I can ask a quick question of regarding the initialization of uv_poll_start on a unix socket so it can catch data sent through on that socket? (it's to communicate with a bluetooth stack)
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14:25:56  <Kakera>should I submit an issue about an internal inconsistency?
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14:26:05  <Kakera>in node's crypto
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14:58:23  <tjfontaine>Kakera: which one?
14:58:49  <tjfontaine>indutny: morning?
14:58:53  <indutny>morning
14:59:09  <tjfontaine>you wanna have a quick call to sync up on stuff, or just want to keep working?
15:01:40  <Kakera>tjfontaine: SignFinal and VerifyFinal call BIO_write directly, everything else uses LoadBIO
15:01:54  <tjfontaine>Kakera: you'll want to ask fedor about that
15:02:14  <Kakera>indutny?
15:02:38  <tjfontaine>aye
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15:06:22  <Kakera>well I suppose he saw the question :)
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15:17:33  <indutny>tjfontaine: I'm into the bitcoin thing right now
15:17:33  <indutny>sorry
15:17:45  <tjfontaine>heh, which bitcoin thing?
15:17:47  <indutny>going to finish it and then start looking at node bugs
15:17:51  <indutny>just a bike-shed
15:17:52  <indutny>:)
15:17:53  <tjfontaine>k
15:18:10  <indutny>right now trying to download all blocks in 2 minutes
15:18:11  <indutny>:)
15:18:18  <indutny>almost got it working
15:18:30  <indutny>(not real blocks, just their headers)
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15:21:16  <indutny>Kakera: I don't mind
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15:22:45  <Kakera>indutny: me submitting an issue?
15:22:50  <indutny>yep
15:22:52  <indutny>or even a PR
15:22:52  <indutny>:)
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15:34:17  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: hi
15:34:22  <tjfontaine>hi
15:34:53  <sinclair|work>so yeah, how is libuv managing synchronization if not by way of the event loop?
15:35:24  <tjfontaine>it is by event loop, it's just the undelrying abstractions do most of the work, it's only windows that behaves differently
15:35:43  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: from .nets point of view, i have....
15:36:41  <sinclair|work>stream.BeginRead(....., (result) => { stream.EndRead(); Loop.Post(() => { /* code here eventually get executed later,...synchronously /* }) });
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15:39:58  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: i guess what i really was keen on about libuv, was the garentee to be synchronous on the main thread, completely doing away with the need for concurrency primitives and what not, no locks, no method interleaving, just plain synchronous and sequential
15:40:52  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: id really like to see the concept taken really far
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15:42:02  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: you know in nodejs, how you currently cannot run multiple loops in process, rather, spawning another requires a new process entirely ?
15:43:18  <tjfontaine>[on the phone, but I see your messages] :)
15:43:25  <sinclair|work>ah cool
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15:53:57  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: i guess what id like to see is, the ability to spawn multiple loops (threads) in process, and have them share access to the same pool of memory....even of the thread(loop) spawning that process was responsible for passing down that memory, something like...
15:54:06  <sinclair|work>var buffer = new Buffer()
15:54:52  <sinclair|work>thread.create(buffer)
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15:55:25  <sinclair|work>which would kick up a entirely new loop,
15:56:19  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: i think the biggest advantage to node is that it promotes things being multiple / portable processes, but there are still instances where it would be good to share a pool of memory between processes
15:56:47  <sinclair|work>without the messaging overhead of going multiple OS processes
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15:57:48  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: lately ive been thinking quite a lot about how that would work in this .net thing i've written
15:57:53  <tjfontaine>sinclair|work: there is no js api for spinning up multiple loops, but libuv supports that
15:58:03  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: oh :)
15:58:24  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: well, then...thats amazing :D
15:58:36  <tjfontaine>sharing resources between loops is not done yet though
15:58:46  <tjfontaine>that is to say, passing a uv_tcp_t from one loop to another
15:58:52  <tjfontaine>but it is something that does need to be added
15:58:59  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: what are your thoughts on it tho?
15:59:14  <tjfontaine>are you asking my thoughts from a feature inside of libuv, or something we would expose in node?
15:59:17  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: in .net land, im thinking about wrapping these extra processes up in AppDomains
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15:59:29  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: nevermind about node :)
15:59:37  <tjfontaine>then yes, it needs done
15:59:44  <tjfontaine>appdomains are exactly what oyu want to fit this model
15:59:55  <tjfontaine>especially because they support readonly and sync already
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16:00:06  <sinclair|work>yeah
16:00:30  <tjfontaine>the hard part about this for node is sharing an object among separate v8 contexts/isolates/instances
16:01:33  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: yeah, i totally hear you on that, honestly tho, id more keen on seeing other things pick up and roll with the feature
16:01:50  * AlexisMochaquit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
16:02:10  <tjfontaine>yup -- but libuv does support multiple loops in a single process today, and there are modules out there using that sort of feature now
16:02:35  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: that's really awesome mate
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16:05:47  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: i think there is such huge potential for all this reactor / libuv stuff. more so when thinking about distributed compute, modular application design, and completely doing away with threads at the user level
16:07:40  <sinclair|work>with the ability to go multi process with a shared memory model, and with some added goodness thrown in (things like parallel execution of synchronous code, perhaps by way of a foreach), it pretty much covers all bases
16:08:07  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: well, thanks for the chat :)
16:10:46  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: oh, i do have a question tho
16:11:10  <sinclair|work>its to do with readable and writeable streams, possibly related to nodejs streams2 interface
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16:12:25  <sinclair|work>i understand the need to have a readable buffer, that fires off a stream.on('readable'), but not so clear on the need for a write buffer
16:14:33  <tjfontaine>sinclair|work: can you rephrase your question?
16:14:34  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: currently, in the implementation i have, i do serialize a bunch of "commands" to be run against the underlying stream, so... [write] [write] [write] [write] [write] [write] [end]
16:14:49  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: its a bit late, sorry, ill try again
16:14:54  <indutny>tjfontaine: what do you think about doing v0.10 and v0.11 releases?
16:15:00  <indutny>it may be not final v0.11 release
16:15:01  <indutny>but anyway
16:15:01  <tjfontaine>I am doing a v0.10 release today for sure
16:15:04  <indutny>cool
16:15:05  <tjfontaine>and we can do 0.11
16:15:12  <indutny>yeah, that would be totally cool
16:15:12  <tjfontaine>but still have one more after that
16:15:12  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: there is a 16k read buffer (default) setting infront of the readable interface
16:15:15  <indutny>yep
16:15:20  <indutny>at least we'll be moving forward
16:15:27  <tjfontaine>indutny: I'll do a libuv 0.11 release if you do an integration?
16:15:35  <indutny>ok
16:15:36  <indutny>let's do it
16:15:44  <tjfontaine>starting
16:16:02  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: there is a 16k writebuffer sitting in front of the writeable stream
16:17:01  <MI6>joyent/libuv: tjfontaine created tag v0.11.25 - https://github.com/joyent/libuv/commit/2acd544cff71
16:17:03  <MI6>joyent/libuv: Timothy J Fontaine master * b5548f1 : Now working on v0.11.26 (+1 more commits) - http://git.io/p_VVpw
16:17:18  <tjfontaine>sinclair|work: ok
16:17:29  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: so, i had a go implementing this, and eventually settled on a command buffer, which serializes the write operations on the underlying stream
16:17:50  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: however, i do not have a fixed size watermark
16:17:52  <tjfontaine>sinclair|work: are we talking about the c# or the c side here?
16:18:45  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: internally, how data structure are you using for the read and write buffers?
16:18:50  <indutny>tjfontaine: updating
16:18:51  <sinclair|work>*how what
16:19:25  <tjfontaine>sinclair|work: so, in node we serialize a series of write requests
16:19:53  <tjfontaine>sinclair|work: very similar to what you're trying to do, and we dispatch to libuv to handle those
16:20:36  <indutny>tjfontaine: seems to be working like a charm
16:20:39  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: ah ok cool, so, how do you handle cases when the writes exceed the maximum buffer size (say, 16k)
16:20:41  <indutny>let me run tests
16:20:51  <indutny>there were no problems building it, at least
16:20:59  <tjfontaine>sinclair|work: in node, hwm is arbitrary as well, but we have an array to queue things up
16:21:05  <tjfontaine>sinclair|work: if someone does try and write more
16:21:19  <tjfontaine>sinclair|work: streams default to 16k, but fs streams are 64k
16:23:33  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: but in theory, there is no limit to the amount of queued up write commands right? its just that you submit at 16k or 64k depending on whats underneath ?
16:24:14  <tjfontaine>well there's a limit to the amount of memory you have :)
16:24:18  <sinclair|work>sure :)
16:24:44  <MI6>joyent/libuv: tjfontaine created tag v0.10.27 - http://git.io/_NhbTg
16:24:46  <MI6>joyent/libuv: Timothy J Fontaine v0.10 * 4f8d4a0 : Now working on v0.10.28 (+1 more commits) - http://git.io/UGhYRQ
16:24:55  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: so, when commands are serialized, they are serialized to the size of the write buffer i suppose
16:25:13  <sinclair|work>i guess that makes sense
16:25:41  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: mate, i really struggled with implementing this stuff
16:25:51  <tjfontaine>sinclair|work: it's not easy, node hasn't always got it right
16:26:10  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: i think i had the most issue understand how pipe should work
16:26:40  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: hang on, let me post you something
16:26:45  <indutny>tjfontaine: done
16:26:48  <MI6>joyent/node: Fedor Indutny master * 3d3d48d : deps: update uv to v0.11.25 - http://git.io/1AUpeQ
16:27:28  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: http://pastebin.com/0KQf1USX
16:27:41  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: which meant implementing pause and resume()
16:28:17  <tjfontaine>oh interfaces.
16:28:19  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: stumbling across fast read and slow write scenarios wasn't even something i gave much thought to,
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16:28:34  <tjfontaine>sinclair|work: yup, and then multiple writers
16:28:51  <tjfontaine>fast reader, fast writer#1, slow writer#2
16:29:02  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: i currently just interleave between read and write
16:29:18  <hueniverse>tjfontaine: 0.11 release today?
16:29:35  <tjfontaine>hueniverse: yes, though not the final one I was hoping for
16:29:43  <hueniverse>k
16:30:02  <hueniverse>tjfontaine: I got till noon, then away for a week.
16:30:43  <tjfontaine>hueniverse: ok, it should be done before noon
16:31:08  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: in all, im left with a deep appreciation of the thought that had gone into libuv, and also how difficult efficient IO actually is :)
16:31:25  <sinclair|work>tjfontaine: anyway mate, ill leave you to it, thanks again for the chat :)
16:31:39  <tjfontaine>sinclair|work: no problemo
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16:36:27  <MI6>joyent/node: Timothy J Fontaine v0.10 * 1038959 : uv: update to v0.10.27 - http://git.io/udN2IA
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16:45:18  <MI6>joyent/node: Trevor Norris master * d1fe685 : buffer: normalize compare() output - http://git.io/TbKk2g
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17:16:43  <isaacs>Any idea when a new 0.10 is coming?
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17:19:58  <tjfontaine>I jsut did a libuv update, going to do one today
17:20:02  <tjfontaine>but first a 0.11
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17:23:06  <isaacs>tjfontaine: kewl
17:23:10  <isaacs>tjfontaine: can i sneak a npm in there?
17:23:18  <isaacs>fixed a bunch of stuff in the last few weeks
17:23:26  <tjfontaine>if you're fast :)
17:23:28  <isaacs>mostly minor test stuff. i'll have an npm release for you shortly
17:23:28  <isaacs>k
17:23:29  <isaacs>thanis
17:23:31  <isaacs>*thanks
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18:08:00  <isaacs>tjfontaine: tl;dr changes https://gist.github.com/isaacs/11457802
18:09:41  <MI6>joyent/node: isaacs v0.10 * f76c393 : npm: upgrade to v1.4.8 - https://github.com/joyent/node/compare/1038959dbf70...f76c3938d066
18:09:43  <tjfontaine>does ~ also do the right thing on windows, or does it rely on env.HOME being set as well?
18:09:46  <tjfontaine>:)
18:11:08  <tjfontaine>I hate you jenkins.
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18:12:11  <bradleymeck>I thought it was USERPROFILE on windows
18:13:05  <tjfontaine>that's why I'm asking -- I had to do that for manta
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18:23:04  <isaacs>tjfontaine: it works on windows because npm puts USERPROFILE into the HOME environ
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18:23:30  <isaacs>tjfontaine: but yeah, it should probably be using osenv.home()
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18:38:35  <bradleymeck>isaacs: have you thought about including a flattener in npm (aliasing the long filenames to shorter ones in npm for windows) or rather, would it be apt since dedupe is in npm... might be better as a separate util but just saw the 256 path thing again and people get crazy
18:39:14  <isaacs>bradleymeck: npm and node are actually fine wiht very long path names
18:39:30  <isaacs>bradleymeck: because they use the \\?\C:\ style urls
18:39:33  <isaacs>er, paths
18:40:01  <bradleymeck>I wonder whats breaking for people in this issue...
18:40:17  <bradleymeck>might not be node itself...
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18:48:51  <tjfontaine>isaacs: when trying to merge 0.10 into 0.11 your url change isn't going through right, hash seems to be encoded
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19:22:17  <isaacs>tjfontaine: oh?
19:22:37  <isaacs>tjfontaine: can you push to a temp branch? happy to take a look.
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19:30:47  <tjfontaine>isaacs: yes
19:31:30  <isaacs>tjfontaine: you mean that the test is failing? or it's colliding or something?
19:31:35  <tjfontaine>test is failing
19:32:02  <MI6>joyent/node: Timothy J Fontaine merge-review * c98bca6 : Merge remote-tracking branch 'upstream/v0.10' (+85 more commits) - http://git.io/tdefig
19:32:10  <tjfontaine>isaacs: ^^
19:32:50  <isaacs>building
19:33:29  <isaacs>weird. the CODE is there
19:33:37  <isaacs>test passes in my brain
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19:37:16  <isaacs>tjfontaine: aha, it's because we urlencode things in the hash
19:37:26  <isaacs>tjfontaine: weird that that's only in master? maybe we called that a breaking change?
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19:38:14  <tjfontaine>isaacs: we must have
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19:44:05  <tjfontaine>isaacs: 17a379ec39a34408477ac6a43751c1b9b2e952a4 moves \ to an unwise character?
19:44:13  <tjfontaine>oh no that's escaping '
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20:13:24  <tjfontaine>oh no, I'm right, because it's concated
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20:16:20  <tjfontaine>isaacs: ok so after 17a379ec39a34408477ac6a43751c1b9b2e952a4 they're encoded because you consider them an autoescape character, is that what you want or would you prefer to revert that part and put it back in unwise
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20:39:12  <tjfontaine>isaacs: even if I normalize against that it's broken for the x:1 case in test-url -- during this merge I'm going to revert your url change, please resubmit a fix and test case that works on master
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20:42:30  <isaacs>tjfontaine: kewl, sounds good
20:42:36  <isaacs>tjfontaine: as long as it gets in before 0.12, i' happy
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20:54:45  <MI6>joyent/node: Timothy J Fontaine master * b19b60a : Merge remote-tracking branch 'upstream/v0.10' (+15 more commits) - http://git.io/kVTVsg
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21:05:03  <MI6>joyent/node: tjfontaine created branch v0.10.27-release - http://git.io/aStf6w
21:07:20  <ryah>when is 0.12 gonna happen anyway?
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21:10:23  <tjfontaine>as soon as we can.
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21:18:57  <ryah>regular releases keep people interested - there's a marketing component to be considered along with the engineering componet.
21:25:50  <trevnorris>afternoon all
21:26:25  <trevnorris>tjfontaine: thanks for merging in that topic branch
21:33:42  <MI6>joyent/libuv: Trevor Norris master * 3259710 : thread: add uv_thread_cb typedef - http://git.io/3k3oBg
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21:44:53  <trevnorris>indutny: thanks :)
21:45:36  <indutny>np
21:45:38  <indutny>you are welcome
21:45:56  <indutny>trevnorris: have you got a chance to take a look at bn.js ?
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21:48:26  <trevnorris>indutny: nope, but i'll have a look :)
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22:19:22  <trevnorris>indutny: i'm impressed you were able to implement all those operations.
22:19:39  <trevnorris>did you take any of the algorithms from other code?
22:23:40  <indutny>thanks man
22:23:49  <indutny>from various books and articles
22:24:37  <trevnorris>coolio
22:24:58  <tjfontaine>ryah: your input has been noted
22:25:46  <indutny>trevnorris: thanks
22:25:56  <indutny>ryah: heya
22:26:04  <indutny>ryah: I'm asking this question myself for a couple of weeks
22:26:08  <indutny>hopefully soon
22:26:21  <trevnorris>you can't rush perfection. ;-)
22:27:34  <mmalecki>'release early, release often' tho
22:27:44  <tjfontaine>mmalecki: releasing things that work is more important
22:27:50  <tjfontaine>also
22:28:05  <tjfontaine>having actually a roadmap for what you know what to release would be good -- node has never really had that
22:28:16  <trevnorris>tjfontaine: oh, slava said that the v8 team is effectively the chromium team wrt v8 updates.
22:28:30  <trevnorris>so their responsible for updating the chromium code w/ the new v8 apis
22:28:35  <tjfontaine>shipping releases with a test suite that was never passing is about the worse things
22:28:39  <mmalecki>tjfontaine: yeah, but imo it doesn't need to be completely feature complete, you can add new features in stable branches
22:28:47  <mmalecki>or did that change?
22:29:03  <tjfontaine>mmalecki: you can't add features in stables
22:29:08  <mmalecki>ah, okay
22:29:11  <mmalecki>gotcha
22:29:41  <MI6>joyent/node: tjfontaine created tag v0.10.27 - http://git.io/DScDRA
22:30:11  <MI6>joyent/node: Timothy J Fontaine v0.10 * 1285008 : Now working on 0.10.28 (+2 more commits) - https://github.com/joyent/node/compare/f76c3938d066...1285008fcaa4
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22:45:11  <MI6>joyent/node: Timothy J Fontaine master * 8637a40 : Merge remote-tracking branch 'upstream/v0.10' (+3 more commits) - https://github.com/joyent/node/compare/b19b60a05c30...8637a40ea8c2
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22:58:52  <indutny>oh gosh
22:59:02  <indutny>I have totally fucked that bcoin thing :)
22:59:10  <indutny>can't get it load whole blockchain reliably
22:59:18  <indutny>already found three different bugs causing it :)
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23:02:49  <indutny>my latest guess is that it is failing because of bloom filter collisions
23:03:14  <indutny>Initially I stored all blocks in a hashmap, but made the GC gone mad
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23:07:02  <MI6>joyent/node: tjfontaine created branch v0.11.13-release - http://git.io/nigMIg
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23:09:07  <isaacs>tjfontaine: so...
23:09:15  <isaacs>tjfontaine: about that npm push... you didn't push that out did you?
23:09:19  <isaacs>tjfontaine: kind of a big bug in it.
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23:30:42  <MI6>joyent/node: isaacs v0.10 * dbec0a0 : npm: upgrade to v1.4.9 - http://git.io/1fdomQ
23:30:53  <isaacs>tjfontaine: ^
23:30:57  <isaacs>sorry again about that.
23:35:29  <rmg>so.. 0.10.28?
23:35:44  <tjfontaine>isaacs: thanks, I'll start this and cut a new 0.10 and abort the current 0.11.13
23:38:41  <isaacs>tjfontaine: thanks
23:39:11  <isaacs>tjfontaine: the silver lining on this unfortunate cloud is that we'll get referer headers, which i thought i'd missed the ship-train on :)
23:39:48  * isaacs.oO(Hm.. tj says we have to get this release ready within the hour, but i need a bit more time to finish this feature... just sneak a little typo in there... ok, back to hacking.)
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