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00:32:49  <owen1>juliangruber: i got the x120e (debian with i3 as my tiled window manager) and it's awesome. i also got macbook air from my employer and like both.
00:36:33  <substack>owen1: I've got one of those :D
00:36:35  <substack>x120e
00:36:41  <substack>I really love the form factor
00:36:51  <owen1>substack: i know. i saw your laptop in LA
00:36:56  <owen1>try i3
00:37:13  <owen1>i just switched from awesomeWM
00:37:42  <substack>does the default config have a bunch of bullshit that I'll need to disable?
00:37:50  <substack>like a menu bar or some noise like that
00:38:42  <owen1>it's redicilously easy. it's just a text file - http://i3wm.org/docs/userguide.html#_configuring_i3bar
00:40:06  <owen1>"The bar at the bottom of your monitor is drawn by a separate process called i3bar"
00:40:37  <owen1>they took the unix approach and created separate process for the status bar
00:42:14  <owen1>and unlike awesomeWM that starts with 9 workspaces, i3 only start with one 'workspace' if u hit mod+number it will created a new workspace.
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00:43:25  <substack>I like how xmonad starts you out in complete nothingness with its default config
00:45:42  <owen1>i belive that by removing the last line of the config file u'll have that - bar { status_command i3status }
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01:18:31  <Raynos>thl0: https://github.com/thlorenz/testlingify/pull/4 !!!
01:20:05  <thl0>Raynos: cool, looks good
01:21:10  <thl0>Raynos: could you rebase this of current HEAD? I'm getting merge conflict
01:21:45  <Raynos>thl0: i merged stuff in
01:21:46  <Raynos>try it again
01:21:51  <thl0>ok
01:22:03  <thl0>cool, github is happy now
01:23:09  <Raynos>thl0: https://github.com/Raynos/dotfiles/commit/a94655222dd72b2806d256aefb378d76a1ae7a26
01:23:26  <Raynos>thl0: this means npmify ( https://github.com/Raynos/dotfiles/blob/master/.functions#L3 ) is done
01:23:40  <thl0>Raynos: awesome!
01:24:19  <isaacs>substack: not only should you not feel bad about using display:table-cell, you should not feel bad about using <table>
01:24:56  <isaacs>substack: the crazy shit is how vertical-align has completely different semantics depending on whether you do display:table-cell, inline-block, or block
01:25:02  <thl0>Raynos: went out as 0.2
01:28:21  <thl0>Raynos: nice, just tried it (even the pw with ***), sweet - good for demos
01:30:12  <Raynos>thl0: o/
01:31:46  <thl0>Raynos: just rebased and it somehow lost logs of your commits
01:32:26  <thl0>well, I'll just make you the author of the entire version change ;)
01:34:06  <thl0>Raynos: in case you wanna commit more you should refork, I just force pushed
01:34:40  <Raynos>thl0: :(
01:34:45  <thl0>clean history though: https://github.com/thlorenz/testlingify/commits/master
01:34:57  <thl0>or just force pull
01:34:59  <Raynos>ok cool
01:35:15  <Raynos>thl0: if you have recommendation on how to make npmify a better bash script or a node module let me know
01:40:29  <thl0>Raynos: will have to play with it some before
01:41:05  <thl0>at this point copying license, .gititnore and then using pkginit and the ifys is working for me
01:42:16  <thl0>Raynos: that github history looks all confused now, but at least you got the credit you deserve ;)
01:42:38  <Raynos>:D
01:42:42  <Raynos>sorry >_<
01:42:43  <thl0>looks like master got rebased onto your changes instead of the other way around
01:42:47  <thl0>np
01:42:52  <thl0>no one will ever notice ;)
01:45:34  <Raynos>thl0: If you see any issues I marked a few already ( https://github.com/Raynos/dotfiles/issues )
01:46:21  <thl0>Raynos: cool just don't show Domenic_ he'll add one "no worky on windows" ;)
01:47:56  <thl0>funny thing is that no one ever complained that you cannot develop .NET apps worth sh*t on a unix
01:48:16  <thl0>I mean Mono is nice to play with, but not for serious develpment
01:48:51  <Raynos>:D
01:48:55  <Raynos>no-one does .NET by choice
01:49:12  <thl0>I used to, but I didn't know any better then
01:49:50  <thl0>now I do it b/c people make me and only if they promise that there is a light at the end of that tunnel ;)
01:50:28  <thl0>although C# is nice
01:50:30  <Raynos>but there is no need
01:50:42  <thl0>no need for what?
01:51:38  <Raynos>doing .NET
01:51:42  <Raynos>or not doing node
01:52:26  <thl0>the more you do the more options you have, but yeah if all you are worried about is doing node all day, now you can find yourself a situation like that
01:52:55  <thl0>enough node work out there at this point and lots of people who don't know what they are doing
01:57:37  <Raynos>I'm not saying only node.
01:57:39  <Raynos>That's optional
01:57:50  <thl0>Raynos: pulled down .functions - so one complaint - hardcoded Raynos
01:58:08  <Raynos>.NET & C# aren't that bad if your not stuck on windows stack
01:58:16  <Raynos>thl0: any idea on how to get github user name
01:58:16  <thl0>it's not only about that though, but also the need to work with smart people
01:58:30  <thl0>from inside a local repo yes
01:58:34  <Raynos>I guess I can assume it's github.config.user
01:58:51  <thl0>Raynos: https://github.com/thlorenz/resolve-git-remote
01:59:08  <thl0>then split on '/'
01:59:10  <Raynos>thl0: we don't have one of those yet because we are calling `hub create` to create a github thing
01:59:21  <thl0>what is hub?
02:00:07  <thl0>Raynos: I guess I could make a bin for resolve-git-remote, then you could pipe the result and xarg it into hub
02:00:27  <Raynos>https://github.com/defunkt/hub
02:00:28  <Raynos>thl0: but we dont have a git folder with a remote yet
02:00:43  <thl0>ah
02:00:57  <thl0>yea, so git.config.user should work
02:01:16  * thl0installs hub
02:01:21  <isaacs>just successfully decrypted an encrypted ssh key in Node with the passphrase and DEK-Info line.
02:01:34  <Raynos>thl0: that assumes your git user and github user name are the same
02:01:38  * isaacsUNLEASHES THE npm PUBLISHES
02:02:39  <thl0>Raynos: then you could solve it with env variables or something or a git config local to each repo
02:02:52  <Raynos>isaacs: ?
02:04:27  <thl0>Raynos: what does this do: hub pull-request -h Raynos:$branch -b Colingo:$branch 2>$result
02:04:49  <Raynos>thl0: aha. hub doesn't need the user name
02:05:00  <Raynos>thl0: creates a pull request from origin:$branch to github:$branch
02:05:20  <Raynos>2>$result is to get the git commit style text editor opening for pull request messages to work in bash scripts
02:05:26  <thl0>ah so you do the same PR each time ? i.e. from Raynos to Colingo?
02:05:33  <Raynos>yep
02:05:38  <Raynos>that's my workflow
02:05:44  <Raynos>PR from my fork into company repo
02:05:57  <thl0>ah, will remember the 2>$result trick
02:07:26  <thl0>Raynos: changed it to hub pull-request -h thlorenz:$branch -b $3:master 2>$result
02:07:43  <thl0>that way I could just call it with the name of the owner I'm pulling onto
02:08:35  <Raynos>oh interesting
02:08:37  <Raynos>that works too
02:08:44  <Raynos>I want to see whether I can do origin:$branch
02:09:23  <Raynos>thl0: why $3 instead of $2 ?
02:09:48  <thl0>Raynos: mistake - thought $2 was taken
02:10:19  <isaacs>Raynos, substack: Module minimality question...
02:10:48  <isaacs>If i have a module that decrypts encrypted ssh private keys, should it read the passphrase, or just expect the caller to provide it?
02:10:59  <isaacs>i'm thinking that it should leave that to the calling code.
02:11:38  <isaacs>but that means that the caller has to also use read() to get that from the user or whatever.
02:12:40  <Raynos>isaacs: it should be given it if the expectation is that passphrase can be read from either disk or stdin
02:15:30  <substack>isaacs: leaving it to the calling code is SO much better
02:15:41  <substack>NEVER EVER EVER read from stdin unprompted EVER
02:15:46  <substack>that is so hard to script around
02:16:00  <substack>either always read from stdin or never do that
02:16:07  <Raynos>thl0: https://github.com/Raynos/dotfiles/commit/e9b0ab7a3a32e79ebc38d35ea25af52b30870a71
02:16:09  <Raynos>Thanks!
02:16:39  <substack>isaacs: if people want that you can always hide the prompt code behind an option, just NEVER turn that option on by default
02:17:07  <Raynos>thl0: https://github.com/Raynos/dotfiles/blob/master/.functions#L49
02:17:10  <substack>can't remember how many times I've had some server process hand someplace because it's waiting for somebody to type a password at the terminal
02:17:16  <Raynos>any recommendations on how to make L49 & L50 less hard coded/
02:17:22  <substack>and there is nobody to type anything because it's a fucking server process
02:17:30  <thl0>Raynos: saw that
02:17:51  <thl0>that's just your projects root ?
02:18:17  <thl0>np to have some things hard coded, just define them at top of your script, so I can config it in one place
02:19:09  <substack>isaacs: yes, vertical-align is a difficult animal to tame
02:22:20  <thl0>Raynos: atal: 'origin' does not appear to be a git repository
02:22:37  <Raynos>thl0: :(
02:22:47  <thl0>I basically just created a dir and ran nstart in it
02:23:31  <substack>more cartoons etc http://browserling.com:9005/
02:23:44  <Raynos>thl0: it will fail for empty directories
02:23:48  <Raynos>because `git add .` adds nothing
02:23:52  <Raynos>and `git commit` fails
02:23:53  <thl0>ah
02:24:41  <thl0>I touched index.js and stilll am seeing it
02:25:00  <thl0>and this right before: Application not found at /Users/thlorenz/dev/js/projects/test-nstart
02:25:12  <thl0>that's the folder I'm running this from
02:25:20  <Raynos>thl0: https://gist.github.com/Raynos/5692393
02:25:40  <Raynos>both testlingify & npm i fail due to lack of package.json the rest works as expected
02:26:03  <Raynos>travis just send me an email "dude wtf Raynos/bar is empty"
02:26:33  <isaacs>substack, Raynos: Yeah, I'm going to diverge from openssl and openssh and not have the decoder automatically prompt.
02:26:47  <isaacs>If you want to do that, you can require('read') yourself
02:27:19  <thl0>Raynos: that's funny, however not working for me
02:27:22  <Raynos>isaacs: maybe opt into it with an option that is false by default
02:27:29  <Raynos>thl0: maybe pull in my latest changes?
02:27:39  <thl0>I did
02:28:22  <thl0>I'll try again- I may have edited something afterwards
02:29:08  * timoxleyquit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
02:30:14  * defunctzombie_zzchanged nick to defunctzombie
02:31:56  <substack>now there's a whole army of video nerds pouring over the footage of the armed robbery last night
02:32:39  <thl0>Raynos: got it it's hub
02:32:57  <thl0>➝ hub
02:32:57  <thl0>Application not found at /Users/thlorenz/dev/js/projects/test-nstart
02:36:39  <Raynos>I see
02:37:05  <thl0>Raynos: I thinkg it's my ruby version
02:37:14  <thl0>installing new 2.0 now
02:39:58  <isaacs>Raynos: but then i have it pulling in read when it's probably not going to be used ever
02:40:11  <thl0>Raynos: OMG I finally got it - I did npm i hub (it's like a muscle reflex)
02:41:00  <thl0>so I got this https://github.com/baryshev/hub doesn't work very well with github ;)
02:42:33  <thl0>Raynos: cool, works now
02:43:07  <thl0>all we need is now to pull LICENSE and .gitignore from a template thing and only do testlingify sometimes
02:43:23  <thl0>it needs a package.json, so we should run pkginit first
02:50:09  <owen1>guys, i started using hubot and i like it a lot. can i add loudbot functionality?
02:50:57  <thl0>Raynos: I'll keep working on nstart a bit i.e. taking params and generating readme, I'll post a link once I have something
03:26:45  * timoxleyjoined
03:30:49  <thl0>Raynos: nstart --tr --te 'A repo to test nstart'
03:31:08  <thl0>produces https://github.com/thlorenz/test-nstart
03:36:37  <Raynos>thl0: ngen does templating
03:37:45  <thl0>you mean in ngen plus?
03:38:01  * wolfeidauquit (Remote host closed the connection)
03:38:04  <thl0>don't know where that stuff is supposed to be stored
03:38:25  <thl0>it should copy whatever I have inside ~/.config/ngen/template
03:38:29  <thl0>or something like that
03:39:44  <thl0>Raynos: here is what I did to get conditional testling/travis
03:39:45  <thl0>https://github.com/thlorenz/dotfiles/blob/master/functions-ngen.sh#L8
03:40:24  <Raynos>thl0: I'm trying to do `cd $PROJECT_DIR` but that fails
03:40:59  <thl0>Raynos: there are some weird expansion tricks in bash that I can't remember
03:41:52  <thl0>probably do cd $($PROJECT_DIR) , but not sure
03:42:56  <Raynos>aha
03:43:00  <Raynos>it chokes on `~`
03:45:02  <Raynos>thl0: so if I update my fork of ngen to check in ~/.config/ngen/template ngenplus becomes more usable?
03:45:20  <thl0>yep, that is unix convention
03:45:29  <thl0>people will know to put stuff there
03:45:44  <thl0>you should of course initialize that if it doesn't exist
03:45:51  <thl0>with some default template
03:45:55  <Raynos>oh i see
03:45:57  <Raynos>thats a good idea
03:46:26  <thl0>at that point you could actually publish that to npm -- I'd install it
03:47:01  <thl0>but testling and travis need to be optional -- I'm still working on getting that working
03:47:09  <Raynos>why optional ?
03:47:25  <Raynos>everything has tests
03:49:11  <Raynos>thl0: https://github.com/thlorenz/dotfiles/blob/master/functions-ngen.sh#L32 is a good idea
03:49:23  <Raynos>I should check whether ngen exists and fall back to npm init
03:49:54  <thl0>Raynos: yea, like https://github.com/thlorenz/dotfiles/blob/master/functions-ngen.sh#L32
03:51:09  <Raynos>thl0: thanks for the help!
03:51:44  <thl0>cool, np it's a good idea, can't wait to get this to work here - gotta wait til tomorrow - kinda late here ;)
03:52:39  <owen1>can anyone help me setup loudbot?
03:54:27  * thl0quit (Remote host closed the connection)
04:01:08  <owen1>i guess i can query the twitter feed - https://api.twitter.com/1/statuses/user_timeline/loudbot.json?count=1&include_rts=true
04:02:01  <Raynos>owen1: did you see https://github.com/Raynos/process-dashboard ?
04:02:23  <owen1>hahaha - "I MUST BE LOUDER TO OVERTAKE SUBSTACK"
04:03:00  <owen1>Raynos: no. looking now
04:04:25  <owen1>not using express. already liking it
04:04:47  <owen1>using tape and nodemon. +2
04:09:40  <owen1>Raynos: running it localy. i can add profiles but what else should i do with this?
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04:10:17  <Raynos>owen1: does nothing
04:10:18  <Raynos>owen1: was going to just say its a recent example
04:10:26  <Raynos>my most recent demo app before this one was like 6 months ago
04:10:50  <owen1>Raynos: oh. for building a website with not frameworks?
04:12:12  <Raynos>yep
04:12:50  <Raynos>its an example of what I do and not what I say. I need more of the former
04:12:55  <owen1>perfect timing. i'll look at the structure/approach and probably learn some stuff. the only exapmle i have is the npm website.
04:14:13  <owen1>oh. i see that you and matt are actively working on it
04:16:13  <Raynos>owen1: yes
04:16:16  <Raynos>Working on it right now
04:20:12  <owen1>i don't think you don't need to require('console')
04:21:59  <Raynos>substack: https://github.com/substack/tape/pull/36
04:22:11  <Raynos>owen1: I don't like globals and like `require`'s explicit-ness
04:23:36  <Raynos>substack: ^ that has tests and no whitespace changes!
04:24:19  <substack>Raynos: what's wrong with the old way?
04:24:24  * defunctzombiechanged nick to defunctzombie_zz
04:24:37  <substack>seems like just extra api for the sake of a small convenience
04:26:05  <Raynos>substack: I need to add this ( https://gist.github.com/Raynos/5692619 ) to the top every http test. This ensures I can run each individual test with `node` and have it work as a HTTP test.
04:26:18  <Raynos>That's either 3 or 7 lines of boilerplate at the start of every http test I am going to write
04:27:12  <Raynos>I've previously had a `endTest(assert)` helper that I've used for this type of thing
04:27:35  <substack>this is all very out of scope for tape
04:27:53  <Raynos>agreed
04:27:58  <Raynos>but it's a small change and is convenient
04:28:02  <substack>if you want these conveniences you could always write a helper lib and publish it to npm
04:28:19  <Raynos>substack: If I refactor the entire test.js thing out into a seperate project does it become not out of scope for tape?
04:28:34  <substack>I don't see what's wrong with how it currently works.
04:28:59  <substack>I would rather squash the bugs that it has than add more surface area for bugs to hide under
04:30:02  <Raynos>substack: what about just https://github.com/substack/tape/pull/36/files#L0R44
04:30:10  <Raynos>then I can at least pass assert.end around as a function
04:37:05  <owen1>Raynos: added your project to the list of 'examples for no-frameworks websites' - https://github.com/oren/node-website-template/commit/ab0ed8b8cf22fe132e4052587228960a4699722d
04:39:00  <Raynos>owen1: cool
04:40:27  <Raynos>isaacs: whats your opinion on lib folders
04:40:45  <Raynos>I find lib folders useful as a place to work on an idea before I'm happy with the concept and then put it on npm
04:41:06  <Raynos>lib folder === eventual npm but it's nice to have it as a limbo state
04:41:58  <owen1>and if u know of more people that are working on similar sites, let me know or tell them to add their sites
04:44:31  <substack>files in lib/ don't always belong in a separate repo
04:45:50  <Raynos>substack: if they stay there forever then they should go a in folder named differently from lib
04:46:06  <Raynos>I feel like things that go in lib are things that look like they might fit in npm with a bit of polish
04:46:26  <Raynos>that or they easily fit in npm but you just want to get shit done right now
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05:13:12  <timoxley>substack how do you handle putting something like auth in front of bouncy?
05:19:31  <substack>in front of?
05:27:10  <Raynos>http://symbo1ics.com/blog/?p=1803
05:27:12  <Raynos>^
05:27:13  * kirbysayshijoined
05:32:45  <Raynos>That kind of thing is scary
05:45:47  <substack>Raynos: "but the code is never more than one or two hundred lines"
05:45:51  <substack>he's still doing it right
05:45:58  <substack>he just doesn't realize it
05:46:06  <substack>give him a module system
05:46:43  * mikolalysenkoquit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
05:46:49  <Raynos>substack: maybe
05:47:05  <Raynos>But take me for example, I write a lot of one or two hundred lines of code but most of them are toys
05:47:32  <stagas>it should be called "copy-paste syndrome"
05:47:49  <Raynos>both not very difficult nor solving a problem useful enough to cause popularity
05:47:57  <Raynos>just writing modular code is not enough
05:49:16  <stagas>substack: that might do the trick
05:50:53  <stagas>but the same thing can happen if you're only using modules for everything and never reinventing the thing
05:52:15  <isaacs>Raynos: i try to avoid them entirely
05:52:20  <isaacs>Raynos: lib folder = "this module is too big"
05:52:29  <Raynos>isaacs: how do you avoid "depth first problem solving"
05:52:34  <isaacs>Raynos: just start hacking on it in node_modules/thing/
05:52:47  <isaacs>Raynos: and do require('thing')
05:52:54  <Raynos>if I ban lib then I end up creating a very balanced node_modules tree and after a day of work have written 10 small modules and not solved the actual problem
05:53:02  <Raynos>Oh I see
05:53:03  <isaacs>Raynos: i'm not saying i never do this mistake i'm describing. i do it all the time
05:53:13  <Raynos>isaacs: do you commit node_modules/thing ?
05:53:15  <isaacs>Raynos: some modules ought to be more than one file.
05:53:19  <isaacs>Raynos: sometimes.
05:53:28  <isaacs>Raynos: but, meh. i dunno. just use a lib folder if you feel like it
05:53:49  <stagas>isaacs: an accidental make clean you'd lose your efforts
05:53:55  <Raynos>I like the idea of "no lib folder === a good thing" and "lib folder === get rid of it if you have enough time"
05:54:08  <isaacs>Raynos: in practice, that's what i actually do
05:54:11  <isaacs>stagas: i guess
05:57:07  <substack>Raynos: a 400 line index.js is worse than a 200 line index.js and a 200 line lib/foo.js
05:57:19  <stagas>you could also have a local dir and make modules in there and bundle them, so they're easily exportable to their own, but that's too much friction
05:57:26  <substack>of course, there are exceptions
05:57:48  <Raynos>stagas: what do you mean? bundle in node_modules ?
05:58:01  <substack>I think the problem is that there are no universal rules, only ideas with guarded applicability
05:58:20  <stagas>Raynos: project/local/foo and bundleDependencies in package.json
05:58:25  <Raynos>stagas: btw I use npmify ( https://github.com/Raynos/dotfiles/blob/master/.functions#L5 ) to compat the "making new modules takes too much time"
05:58:27  <substack>when conditions A and B are true, C usually holds unless D is true in which case E might be a valid approach
05:58:33  <Raynos>creating a new module is faster then dicking around with bundleDeps
05:59:26  <stagas>Raynos: nice! I have one too https://github.com/stagas/project
05:59:29  <stagas>:)
06:00:05  <Raynos>stagas: https://github.com/Raynos/dotfiles/blob/master/.functions#L16 project is half of it. The other half is auto test hooks / github repo / npm publish
06:01:15  <Raynos>stagas: what is it with https://github.com/stagas/project/blob/master/templates/node.js/index.js
06:01:18  <Raynos>that ^ is really annoying
06:01:46  <stagas>maybe hehe
06:03:11  <stagas>maybe it's about "oh I'm in a node project" when index.js points to lib
06:03:17  <stagas>:P
06:05:27  <Raynos>no
06:05:40  <Raynos>it's about "I copy TJ blindly and don't know how to structure code project" when index.js points to lib
06:05:57  <Raynos>you dont do that shit for component.js :/
06:06:30  <stagas>lol
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06:07:13  <Raynos>this is not funny. This is sad.
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06:07:39  <stagas>what exactly
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06:09:08  <Raynos>the index.js & lib/{{project}} pattern
06:09:10  <Raynos>either have no index.js
06:09:15  <Raynos>or no lib/{{project}}
06:09:18  <Raynos>don't do both
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06:10:36  <stagas>if the project grows in scope you might want to export a few things from different lib/ files, would you then go by refactoring index.js to lib files and move the exports there, or just start in lib/ from the start
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06:15:58  <Raynos>stagas: I dont do "lib is my module / app code"
06:16:47  <Raynos>stagas: I do stuff like this https://github.com/Raynos/jsonml-stringify
06:16:50  <Raynos>start in index.js
06:17:00  <Raynos>and created named files at the root if you need more shit
06:17:07  <Raynos>if the root is too clustered then write more smaller things
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06:18:56  <stagas>but that's entirely subjective, it's not that using lib/ to put your module files is sad, it's just a preference
06:21:56  <Raynos>stagas: but then have ./lib/{{project}} re-export the other lib files
06:22:05  <Raynos>stagas: but then have ./lib/{{project}} re-export the other lib files
06:23:11  <stagas>I really don't see many differences in the two ways, they both have some benefits, they both have some ugliness, but not much that it matters anyway
06:28:20  <jesusabdullah>Yeah, I got better things to do :/
06:28:55  <owen1>trying to add loudbot to hubot - https://github.com/oren/lee-bot-perry/commit/1da41fd66a92b29271128260e8fec9d01c546bdd i am in infinite loop there...
06:28:57  <Raynos>stagas: the main problem is that when I open an index.js expecting to see implementation details and all it is, is a proxy to a file in lib then my time is wasted
06:29:21  <Raynos>this happens a lot and is frustrating for no reason. If there was no index.js I would jump to lib/{{project}} immediately and there would be no rage
06:29:24  <stagas>Raynos: I agree with that annoyance
06:29:42  <owen1>i tell hubot to scream when he see all caps, so he screams forever and i run out of memory
06:29:43  <Raynos>stagas: I actually tend to have the meat of the thing in index.js but also add 10 lines to the bottom where index.js exports all the other files as well as properties
06:30:49  <Raynos>that's when I actually bother to have index.js re-export
06:31:09  <Raynos>stagas: normally I just don't re-export anything. If you want it, then require it `require("x/y.js")` instead of `require("x").y
06:32:46  <stagas>Raynos: that's also possible
06:32:50  <stagas>Raynos: that's what I meant with the effect "I'm in a node project", opening index.js and seeing the redirect is so common but mostly in node projects. components are index.js to save bytes and keep the scope small
06:33:40  <Raynos>but there is no point in redirection
06:33:55  <stagas>we're entering a loop[
06:33:57  <stagas>:P
06:34:03  <Raynos>it's just cultist behaviour of "this is stupid. But we must do it for ceremony"
06:35:04  <stagas>humans
06:35:06  <owen1>i also noticed that some of you guys like 4 spaces. not sure why..
06:35:35  <owen1>i want to fork all your repos, change to 2 spaces and send pull request
06:35:44  * owen1hide
06:36:19  <stagas>how about we make all editors and highlighters just display code in our style, and everyone sees it in theirs
06:37:24  <owen1>can i open a 4 spaces project in vim and view it as 2?
06:38:58  <stagas>then we wouldn't have style debates and life would be so boring
06:39:38  <owen1>ahah
06:40:39  <Raynos>owen1: yes you can
06:40:44  <Raynos>it's called everybody uses tabs
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07:32:21  <Raynos>Does anyone have a good code coverage thing?
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08:04:12  <isaacs>substack, pkrumins: Remember when i was asking about that ssh key decrypting thing? http://npm.im/ssh-key-decrypt
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10:17:18  <Raynos>coveralls is awesome
10:17:31  <Raynos>online coverage reports ( https://coveralls.io/r/Raynos/process-dashboard )
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10:45:18  <pkrumins>isaacs: yes i remember; i'm looking at ssh-key-decrypt right now
10:47:57  <pkrumins>nice job isaacs!
10:49:40  <Nexxy>rofl @ 'hoohah'
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17:30:45  <owen1>Raynos: wow, looks pretty. where is this ui? https://github.com/Raynos/process-dashboard
17:31:07  <owen1>when i run it localy the UI looks empty
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18:05:11  <defunctzombie>I like how the badges say dependencies up to date and out of date
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18:20:10  <calvinfo>has anyone here used cluster when dealing with a lot of reqs/sec ?
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18:20:46  <calvinfo>we're seeing odd CPU spikes, and it doesn't seem to be round-robin'd as much as I'd expect
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19:46:20  <dominictarr>ralphtheninja: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&v=L9vApadGOu0&NR=1
19:46:36  <dominictarr>(although, I'm sure you have seen this one already)
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19:58:29  <st_luke>hij1nx
20:02:29  <juliangruber>st_luke: where you at?
20:02:35  <juliangruber>also, hij1nx
20:02:39  <st_luke>pretzel berg
20:02:57  <juliangruber>:D
20:03:07  <st_luke>i think paulo is in k-berg
20:03:44  <juliangruber>im in tiergarten / mitte
20:05:00  <juliangruber>what is the plan for today / tomorrow?
20:05:08  <juliangruber>need to do some stuff tomorrow...
20:07:03  <ralphtheninja>dominictarr: you were wrong! I haven't seen it :)
20:07:22  <ralphtheninja>dominictarr: been away on festival to get away from the computer for a while
20:08:04  <dominictarr>oh, nice
20:08:04  <st_luke>juliangruber: once polo gets back from dinner with his lady we're supposed to meet up
20:08:12  <st_luke>juliangruber: have to find a place close enough for all of us
20:08:44  <juliangruber>oh, meet today?
20:08:55  <juliangruber>my number is 015775337546 btw
20:09:08  <st_luke>juliangruber: i dont have a phone here so email is probably better
20:09:14  <dominictarr>ralphtheninja: the bomb drop is that in greece they are talking about 'work camps" for people who can't afford to pay taxes...
20:09:17  <juliangruber>ok
20:09:47  <juliangruber>st_luke: i cannot stay on internet for much longer....where will i receive notage of the meetup?
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20:10:06  <st_luke>juliangruber: do you have email on your phone?
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20:10:55  <juliangruber>i only have the firefox os phone with me
20:11:04  <juliangruber>so, no :D
20:11:09  <juliangruber>hm
20:11:17  <juliangruber>i can just take a ride to your place
20:12:22  <st_luke>ok I'm at
20:12:38  <st_luke>immanuelkirchstrauße 12
20:13:00  <st_luke>in p-burg
20:13:14  <st_luke>how far are you?
20:16:50  <ralphtheninja>dominictarr: work camps? that sounds familiar .. are they neo nazis or? :)
20:17:04  <dominictarr>sadly, yes
20:17:09  <ralphtheninja>have to check it out
20:17:20  <dominictarr>the "golden dawn" party in greece
20:17:30  <dominictarr>their logo even looks like a swastika
20:18:16  <juliangruber>st_luke:taking a cab, should be there in 20min
20:18:17  <st_luke>dominictarr: did you see how one of their members yelled out 'hier hitler' at a government hearing recently?
20:18:26  <juliangruber>st_luke:what does the door sign say?
20:18:27  <st_luke>hiel
20:18:28  <st_luke>i mean
20:18:32  <dominictarr>no,
20:18:35  <ralphtheninja>I think it's a sign that the polical system is not sound and well .. stuff fucks up and parties like that feed on it
20:18:43  <dominictarr>but I have seen enough
20:18:46  <st_luke>juliangruber: it has the number, but ill go outside and wait 10 mins after you leave
20:18:53  <juliangruber>nice
20:18:56  <juliangruber>i leave now :D
20:18:58  <juliangruber>cya
20:19:15  <st_luke>the golden dawn party has an unfortunate amount of representatives in the greek political system
20:19:23  * jxsonquit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
20:19:39  <ralphtheninja>st_luke: how much do they have?
20:19:41  <dominictarr>greece is in a situation where people want to have a strong leader
20:19:58  <dominictarr>there is lots of research into the psychology of this
20:20:29  <st_luke>in june 2012 they had 6.9% of votes in greek parliament
20:20:33  <dominictarr>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right-wing_authoritarianism
20:20:35  <ralphtheninja>people are sheep .. sigh .. another strong leader will just create another version of the state
20:21:20  <st_luke>18 seats
20:21:31  <ralphtheninja>that's a lot
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20:21:57  <st_luke>pretty high number for a fringe political party started from a hate group
20:22:08  <ralphtheninja>it's pretty much the same in all european countries, not all parties are as explicit as the one in greece though
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20:22:35  <ralphtheninja>we have the same shit in sweden, just wrapped in another package
20:23:21  <dominictarr>yes, but the situation is much better in sweden
20:23:57  <dominictarr>support for this type of thing changes with people's situations
20:24:39  <dominictarr>when people are scared, they are more likely to follow authority
20:24:50  <ralphtheninja>definitely, just saying that it has gotten worse here as well, even though it's better
20:25:32  <ralphtheninja>better than in other places*
20:27:04  <dominictarr>sure
20:37:51  <dominictarr>ralphtheninja: also http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NH5Aol3z2mk&feature=youtu.be
20:38:06  <dominictarr>has a pretty funny bit on hyperinflation in daiblo 3
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20:54:36  <ralphtheninja>dominictarr: on it :)
20:55:29  <ralphtheninja>dominictarr: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=-U4gkByMpL4
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20:59:45  <dominictarr>ralphtheninja: also, wrote this the other day: https://github.com/dominictarr/pull-level
20:59:47  <dominictarr>oops
20:59:58  <dominictarr>I meant this https://github.com/dominictarr/pull-window
21:00:19  <dominictarr>would be useful for tracking prices...
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21:18:22  <ins0mnia>dominictarr: ping
21:18:39  <dominictarr>ins0mnia: hey, whats up?
21:19:17  <ins0mnia>dominictarr: all good, still stuck here :( moving coming wednesday the landlord is such a pain in the ass... anyway, working with scuttlebutt
21:20:05  <ins0mnia>dominictarr: and I'm trying to figure out a way to "turn off" scuttlebutt/events history, it does defeat the purpose but it's needed in some cases (like what I'm working on ow)
21:20:19  <dominictarr>what is the use-case?
21:21:02  <ins0mnia>dominictarr: the use case is that I have a p2p network and I need to trigger notification events, i.e. let each peer go through connected clients and send a notification to them
21:21:22  <ins0mnia>dominictarr: but if the connected clients are not connected, don't want to trigger an event
21:21:43  <ins0mnia>dominictarr: because they will get the last count the moment they connect, from there, I start sending events
21:21:57  <ins0mnia>so basically, events keep piling up
21:22:08  <ralphtheninja>dominictarr: cool!
21:22:56  <dominictarr>ins0mnia: oh, I see
21:23:04  <ins0mnia>donno if I managed to explain myself correctly, but basically I'm using scuttlebutt/event to tell a peers "go through your list of connected clients, and send them a notification"
21:23:08  <dominictarr>are you using scuttlebutt/event?
21:23:12  <ins0mnia>dominictarr: yeah
21:23:16  <dominictarr>ah
21:23:54  <ins0mnia>I mean in theory this could be written as a simple standalone module
21:23:55  * jxsonquit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
21:24:00  <ins0mnia>but I'm using scuttlebutt (and I like it)
21:24:06  <dominictarr>what is that data in the event?
21:24:11  <dominictarr>what does it describe?
21:24:20  <dominictarr>and what do you use it for?
21:25:12  <ins0mnia>the event data contains a list of user_slugs (or user_id's), so when the peer receives an event, it loops through the connected clients, filter out the ones which are within this array and send them a notification
21:26:09  <ins0mnia>I'm intentionally not keeping the list of connected clients as a shared model, in this case, I just want to send an event to all peers that says look through those X client and send them a notification if they are on your list of connected clients
21:26:46  <ins0mnia>so if the peer goes down, then it goes up again
21:27:09  <ins0mnia>it's basically trouble :)
21:27:39  <ins0mnia>notifications will be flying all over the place
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21:42:44  <dominictarr>ins0mnia: are you using scuttlebutt/events to distribute a list of user_slugs?
21:42:59  <dominictarr>that seems more like a scuttlebutt/model thing
21:43:06  <ins0mnia>dominictarr: yes
21:43:24  <ins0mnia>dominictarr: yeah but model will keep history too
21:44:00  <ins0mnia>anyway it's not a biggie I can work around it, just wanted to mention this use-case to you
21:44:05  <dominictarr>so, you want to keep only the current set of connected users?
21:44:36  <ins0mnia>dominictarr: I am doing that, then I'm using scuttlebutt/events to distribute an array of connected users to notify
21:45:00  <dominictarr>scuttlebutt is really just a handshake protocol, you can subclass it to suit many different types of data
21:45:04  <ins0mnia>dominictarr: once they are notified, this data/array is no longer needed
21:45:22  <dominictarr>are they only notified once?
21:45:32  <ins0mnia>dominictarr: yup
21:45:33  <dominictarr>or is it whenever they are connected?
21:45:46  <ins0mnia>dominictarr: as long as they are connected they get notifications
21:45:58  <ins0mnia>dominictarr: otherwise, they shouldn't receive past notifications (history)
21:46:25  <dominictarr>right - but the connected user list is different
21:46:26  <ins0mnia>dominictarr: because the next time they connect, they will get a "counter" of unread notifications (pulled from the db)
21:46:39  <ins0mnia>dominictarr: yes, the connected user-list is different
21:46:42  <dominictarr>right
21:46:46  <ralphtheninja>ins0mnia: you are only interested in events from time of connection and onward
21:47:02  <ralphtheninja>fuck history! :)
21:47:08  <ins0mnia>dominictarr: each peer has it's own list, I'm just sending an event which tells if any of those are connected, right now, and they are on your list, notify them
21:47:10  <ins0mnia>ralphtheninja: lol
21:47:34  <dominictarr>I don't clearly understand exactly what you are doing, but I think that maybe you should use a different scuttlebutt to scuttlebutt/events
21:48:45  <ins0mnia>dominictarr: say we have 3 peers, each with a different list of connected users, one of them will trigger an event that says if this and this user is currently on your list then notify them and do nothing otherwise
21:48:46  <dominictarr>so, 1) each server has a bunch of connections (each attached to a name)
21:49:45  <ins0mnia>(correct)
21:50:06  <dominictarr>then, you broardcast a message to the other servers, which may result in messages to their clients?
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21:50:59  <ins0mnia>correct
21:51:36  <dominictarr>how are the servers connected together?
21:51:46  <dominictarr>do they all have connections to each other?
21:51:50  <dominictarr>or is there a leader?
21:51:55  <ins0mnia>a leader
21:51:59  <dominictarr>right
21:52:32  <ins0mnia>if the leader goes down, another one assumes the role, so there's a split second in this case
21:52:42  <dominictarr>so, the leader just bounces the messages on to the other servers?
21:52:42  <ins0mnia>which is ok
21:52:47  <ins0mnia>yup
21:53:00  <ins0mnia>but any of the other servers can trigger the message
21:53:09  <dominictarr>right - so I'd probably recommend using https://github.com/Raynos/expiry-model
21:53:30  <dominictarr>which raynos wrote because he wanted a scuttlebutt that didn't keep history forever
21:53:30  <ins0mnia>looked at it, need something like expirty-events
21:53:37  <ins0mnia>yeah
21:53:38  <substack> /win 20
21:53:41  <substack>ignore that
21:53:53  <dominictarr>well, you can just make the new key a timestamp
21:54:00  <dominictarr>but same diff either way
21:54:08  <ins0mnia>true
21:54:26  <dominictarr>ins0mnia: implementing a scuttbutt is fairly simple
21:54:45  <dominictarr>you just implement a history function and applyUpdate function
21:55:16  <ins0mnia>or alternatively just write a simple module that bounces messages between all servers without caring about aknowledgment or history
21:55:31  <dominictarr>that too
21:55:39  <ins0mnia>because to me this seems outside scuttlebutt's scope
21:55:44  <ins0mnia>but it could be in a way
21:55:49  <dominictarr>you could use duplex-emitter
21:55:53  * tilgoviquit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
21:55:55  <dominictarr>or remote-events
21:57:51  <ins0mnia>probably duplex-emitter (I think?) because in theory if one server triggers and event, it will need to go to the leader which will need to relay it to everyone
21:58:00  <ins0mnia>and = and
21:58:01  <ins0mnia>and
21:58:02  <ins0mnia>an
21:58:04  <ins0mnia>(fuck me)
22:00:55  <ins0mnia>ahhh
22:01:31  <ins0mnia>leader peer <-> duplex-emitter <-> peer
22:01:52  <ins0mnia>this will solve it :)
22:02:33  <ins0mnia>peer emits an event -> event reaches leader -> leader emits an event to everyone
22:02:38  <ins0mnia>:))
22:03:02  <ins0mnia>and if peer X is dead, well, too bad, don't care in this case :)
22:03:09  <ins0mnia>cuz there are no connections on it anyway
22:03:13  <ins0mnia>(talking to myself)
22:03:17  <ins0mnia>thanks dominic :))
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22:08:38  <Raynos>ahoy browserify people!
22:08:59  <Raynos>I'm writing some front end tests with the classical `var client = require('../../browser/client')`
22:09:11  <Raynos>has anyone figured out how to make require statements for tests less foldery?
22:09:23  <Raynos>I guess I could symlink browser into npm
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22:20:18  <dominictarr>ins0mnia: duplex-emitter and remote-events both do the same thing
22:21:41  <dominictarr>Raynos: If you don't want them to be so foldery, use less folders
22:21:47  <ins0mnia>dominictarr: ahhh cool (haven't seen remote-events before)
22:21:56  <Raynos>dominictarr: this is an app.
22:22:11  <dominictarr>apps are an antipattern!
22:22:14  <Raynos>I'm just going to try and symlink things
22:22:44  <Raynos>dominictarr: it would be hard to break up ( https://github.com/Raynos/process-dashboard ) :/
22:22:57  <dominictarr>just make your so-called "application" some modules and then give your users a repl!
22:23:14  <Raynos>but i want a GUI ;_;
22:23:16  <Raynos>GUI GUI GUI
22:24:11  <dominictarr>Raynos: also, too many badges
22:24:21  <Raynos>dominictarr: NOT ENOUGH BADGES
22:24:25  <Raynos>I WANT MORE BADGES
22:25:14  <dominictarr>can you make a badgerage badge that combines all badges into one voltronesque badge?
22:25:50  <dominictarr>Raynos: there has to be some way to make a gui without it being so railroady
22:27:17  <Raynos>maybe
22:29:29  <Raynos>dominictarr: railroady ?
22:29:44  <dominictarr>I mean, it only does things
22:29:55  <dominictarr>that you can do by clicking buttons
22:30:20  <dominictarr>it totally turns it from a magical scriptable thing into something boring
22:30:48  <Raynos>it is kind of boring
22:30:50  <dominictarr>why can't we have modular, composable interfactes
22:30:57  <dominictarr>?
22:31:17  <Raynos>i could break it into modules if I wanted to
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22:51:27  <rowbit>/!\ ATTENTION: (default-local) [email protected] successfully signed up for developer browserling plan ($20). Cash money! /!\
22:51:27  <rowbit>/!\ ATTENTION: (default-local) paid account successfully upgraded /!\
22:51:38  <substack>yay
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23:06:52  <thl0>Raynos: https://github.com/thlorenz/dotfiles/blob/a0f5bdfca54594b55f8c05fc554a6aaf13516c3c/functions-ngen.sh#L9-L48
23:07:12  <thl0>now I can selectively add travis or testling -a -s
23:07:35  <Raynos>:)
23:07:41  <Raynos>i just have them always on
23:08:31  <substack>http://browserling.com:9005/
23:09:04  <thl0>ok, doesn't make sense for some packs though (i.e. why use testling for serverside only stuff)
23:09:44  <thl0>substack: looks like the design got some real love
23:10:32  <thl0>substack: btw we need to change the 'module driven development' to 'package driven development'
23:10:42  <substack>oh?
23:10:42  <thl0>after all it's npm not nmm ;)
23:10:46  <substack>I guess I conflate those in my head.
23:11:10  <thl0>when I picked the phrase, I was trying to pun on model driven development
23:12:01  <thl0>substack: but there is a slight difference i.e. packages == on npm vs. module == in ./lib
23:12:25  <substack>the difference seems rather subtle
23:12:36  <substack>I find myself using the "module" term to include both
23:13:06  <thl0>some people think it's different - i.e. Domenic convinced me that to not use modurater, so I changed it to valuepack
23:13:07  <substack>modules are what you can do when you've got a module system in place
23:13:51  <thl0>so maybe it's clear to us, but others get confused, so I'll try to stick to packages for stuff you can install and modules for stuff that's just local
23:14:45  <substack>I'll cover both kinds of reuse in that article
23:14:59  <thl0>substack: it's package.json not module.json, so you technically publish a package
23:16:17  <thl0>substack: you wanna drive home though, that it's not truly module/package driven if you don't publish it
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