00:00:01  * ircretaryquit (Remote host closed the connection)
00:00:08  * ircretaryjoined
00:04:21  * AvianFluquit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
00:08:38  * Maciek416quit (Remote host closed the connection)
00:08:57  * Maciek416joined
00:09:12  * Maciek416_joined
00:10:05  * jxsonjoined
00:10:56  * phatedjoined
00:13:20  * Maciek416_quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
00:18:59  * tobiequit (Quit: tobie)
00:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 135]
00:32:41  * AvianPhonejoined
00:33:22  * tobiejoined
00:33:24  * eugenewarejoined
00:42:07  * indexzerojoined
00:42:41  * phated_joined
00:46:25  * phatedquit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
00:48:10  * phated_changed nick to phated
00:48:33  * Aviaphonejoined
00:50:12  * fallsemoquit (Quit: Leaving.)
00:50:57  * eugenewarequit (Remote host closed the connection)
00:53:00  * AvianPhonequit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
00:53:21  * thlorenzjoined
00:53:58  * eugenewarejoined
00:55:15  * thealphanerdquit (Quit: thealphanerd)
00:56:00  * joatesjoined
00:57:35  * AvianFlujoined
00:59:12  * Aviaphonequit (Quit: Bye)
01:06:10  * thealphanerdjoined
01:06:27  * ferossquit (Quit: feross)
01:12:32  * thealphanerdquit (Quit: thealphanerd)
01:17:51  * thealphanerdjoined
01:20:10  * jxsonquit (Remote host closed the connection)
01:22:44  * ednapiranhaquit (Remote host closed the connection)
01:24:21  * jxson_joined
01:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: []
01:28:56  * tobiequit (Quit: tobie)
01:29:09  * jxson_quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
01:29:23  * jxsonjoined
01:31:02  * dominictarrjoined
01:31:30  * kevino80joined
01:31:58  <dominictarr>substack, in feedopensource api and the views are all just unix tools https://github.com/dominictarr/feedopensource/blob/master/development.md
01:34:13  * ednapiranhajoined
01:37:19  * phatedquit (Remote host closed the connection)
01:41:23  * jcrugzzjoined
01:44:14  <substack>dominictarr: I do pretty much that for data -> view with streams
01:44:25  <substack>except not in the shell
01:45:07  * ednapiranhaquit (Quit: Leaving...)
01:48:21  <dominictarr>substack, yeah, I just did it like that in the shell because requests took a long time since it falls back to another service over http, and I have unreliable internet + rate limit.
01:48:53  <dominictarr>but the interesting thing, that having it in the shell makes testing it really easy.
01:49:11  <dominictarr>you can save the view data, and just test the views against it, etc
01:49:12  <substack>the shell is like living inside the computer
01:49:31  <dominictarr>YES EXACTLY
01:49:31  <LOUDBOT>MY NET IS FUCKING AWESOME AGAIN.
01:51:01  * mikolalysenkoquit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
01:51:03  <dominictarr>and the GUI is like travelling to a foreign country, where you do not speak the language, pointing at things you want to eat/buy.
01:51:25  <dominictarr>and probably getting ripped off
01:54:12  * guest123456532joined
01:55:30  * guest123456532quit (Client Quit)
01:55:45  * phatedjoined
01:56:06  * ednapiranhajoined
01:59:12  * jxsonquit (Remote host closed the connection)
02:03:06  * fallsemojoined
02:03:12  * fallsemoquit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
02:03:23  * fallsemojoined
02:05:34  <joates>dominictarr: would it help if we can setup a tunnel/VPN to me (i'm in London, i have unlimited broadband :)
02:06:30  <joates>i have a quad core Xeon, i can open some ports for you :))
02:09:18  * ferossjoined
02:09:26  <nexxy>dominictarr, your feedopensource.com cert is bad
02:09:42  <nexxy>just in case you weren't aware
02:10:40  <substack>I get a lock with a yellow triangle on it in chrome
02:12:00  <nexxy>I got a giant scary red screen :(
02:12:42  <nexxy>http://i.imgur.com/8Cegkd6.png
02:13:04  <dominictarr>joates, no that wouldn't really help
02:13:45  <joates>dominictarr: ok
02:13:52  <dominictarr>nexxy, thanks. uh a guess that free ca might be no good.
02:13:53  * phatedquit (Remote host closed the connection)
02:13:57  <nexxy>http://imgur.com/zSUJVt3.png
02:14:06  <nexxy>http://imgur.com/iWrWPby.png
02:14:07  <nexxy>dominictarr, yeah :(
02:15:32  <nexxy>rapidSSL has some cheap certs
02:15:54  <nexxy>there's also startssl.com
02:16:21  <pkrumins>namecheap.com too
02:16:41  <nexxy>yeah
02:16:45  <nexxy>~$10 USD
02:16:45  <LOUDBOT>DON'T EAT POISON DONGS
02:16:52  <nexxy>GREAT ADVICE, LOUDBOT
02:16:53  <LOUDBOT>WHEN THE LIGHT HITS THE SCREEN A CERTAIN WAY I CAN SEE A SHIT LOAD OF DUST
02:17:14  <nexxy>untainted dongs are the safest bet
02:17:44  * ednapiranhaquit (Quit: Leaving...)
02:18:14  * kumavis_joined
02:18:15  * marcello3dquit (Remote host closed the connection)
02:18:50  * marcello3djoined
02:21:52  <dominictarr>substack, okay, now it has a green padlock on chromium
02:22:27  <dominictarr>nexxy, you are inside the garden of pure ideology?
02:22:36  <nexxy>yes
02:22:57  <kumavis>dominictarr: im seeing red x over lock in chrome 31
02:23:27  * marcello3dquit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
02:23:38  <dominictarr>I went to startssl and they where like we have to review your application (probably because my ip is in south east asia, and they are racist)
02:24:15  <nexxy>dominictarr, need a tunnel?
02:24:25  <nexxy>I have one in fremont
02:24:29  <nexxy>CALIFORNIA
02:25:47  <dominictarr>nexxy, I ssh into my digital ocean in NY
02:25:56  <nexxy>oh well there you go
02:26:04  <dominictarr>but I wasn't using that when I signed up to startssl
02:26:10  <nexxy>:(
02:26:20  <dominictarr>oh, you think this is just a east coast / west coast thing?
02:26:54  <nexxy>if I recall correctly
02:27:00  <nexxy>there is a little bit of verification for anyone
02:27:26  <nexxy>possibly more for you cuz you're registering from a geographical location that may be responsible for a higher than average number of fraud attempts
02:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [free: 118]
02:30:26  <kumavis>i think i accidentally volunteered off of node projects and on to a windows project
02:30:31  <kumavis>at work
02:30:50  <kumavis>how to undo
02:31:08  <kumavis>abort
02:34:30  <dominictarr>nexxy, hey, on a dollar value basis, there is probably more faud coming out of NY
02:34:45  * kevino80quit (Remote host closed the connection)
02:34:56  <joates>:-O
02:34:59  <dominictarr>kumavis, open the console, type ls
02:35:07  <dominictarr>then ask why it doesn't work
02:35:22  <kumavis>try not to cry, cry a lot
02:36:10  <kumavis>they tempted me with the thought of extending cad tools
02:38:44  <jcrugzz>but WINDOWS
02:38:50  <jcrugzz>:(
02:40:48  <joates>dominictarr: i've been looking over the tests, think i understand better now.. you separate the request & parse functionality so that you can use static data to test *only* the parsing?
02:41:15  <joates>..without a connection.
02:41:59  <dominictarr>joates, exactly.
02:42:07  * dguttmanquit (Quit: dguttman)
02:42:23  <dominictarr>also, then at the output of that phase, you could test the templates, using more static data.
02:43:28  <joates>dominictarr: i'm going to spend most of today, getting more familiar with yr workflow.. but i'll be available if you need anything also :)
02:46:26  <joates>dominictarr: fyi i fetched & merged my fork so i'm up-to-date.
02:47:08  * mikolalysenkojoined
02:50:30  <dominictarr>nexxy, kumavis try again now, using rapidssl
02:51:01  <kumavis>looking mean and green : )
02:51:05  <dominictarr>joates, cool, I put some stuff in development.md
02:51:24  <dominictarr>also, use kumavis cool
02:52:41  <kumavis>jcrugzz: yeah, i'll be running it in a vm and trying to touch it directly as little as possible
02:52:49  * mikolalysenkoquit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
02:52:56  <jcrugzz>kumavis: best of luck to you
03:06:22  * mikolalysenkojoined
03:06:22  * thealphanerdquit (Quit: thealphanerd)
03:11:49  * mikolalysenkoquit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
03:12:53  * jxsonjoined
03:13:10  * thealphanerdjoined
03:17:16  * jxsonquit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
03:17:48  <joates>dominictarr: var bar = btcprogress()
03:17:52  * joateslols
03:21:01  * kumavis_quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
03:21:07  * mikolalysenkojoined
03:23:36  * coderzachquit (Remote host closed the connection)
03:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 1, free: 82]
03:29:34  * eugenewarequit (Remote host closed the connection)
03:30:09  * eugenewarejoined
03:30:32  * eugenewarequit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
03:30:39  <pkrumins>new blog post! ie11's at browserling: http://www.catonmat.net/blog/browserling-now-has-ie11/
03:30:43  * fallsemoquit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
03:30:56  * yorickquit (Remote host closed the connection)
03:31:25  * eugenewarejoined
03:33:26  * thealphanerdquit (Quit: thealphanerd)
03:34:41  * dguttmanjoined
03:42:40  * fallsemojoined
03:45:55  <ogd>contrahax: nerdjs6 is definitely the best one
03:49:40  <dominictarr>joates, is there a ploblem?
03:52:27  * kumavis_joined
03:54:13  * fallsemoquit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
03:55:16  * thealphanerdjoined
03:56:36  <substack>ogd: will going to send that PR or should I just fix git-http-backend?
03:57:29  <substack>how about I'll just fix it and you can tell me if the fix worked?
03:57:58  <joates>dominictarr: no just laughing at yr choice of var name :)
03:59:42  <dominictarr>bar?
04:00:08  <dominictarr>well, it IS a bar... nothing to do with foo or baz!
04:01:42  * thlorenzquit (Remote host closed the connection)
04:01:55  <joates>yep it *is* a bar
04:03:39  * thealphanerdquit (Quit: thealphanerd)
04:04:20  <ogd>substack: feel free to fix it
04:04:27  <ogd>substack: i may pr some tests tomorrow
04:04:39  * calvinfoquit (Quit: Leaving.)
04:05:09  <substack>some tests would rock
04:06:20  <substack>ogd: ok 0.1.0 published
04:08:30  <dominictarr>jjjohnny, can you claim your feedopensource contribution: right now grumpy cat is getting the credit https://feedopensource.com/iteration/dominictarr/feedopensource/1PTAwipYpP63uNrcxfm5FewxRdZyar6ceu
04:09:41  * thealphanerdjoined
04:14:53  * fallsemojoined
04:14:54  * thealphanerdquit (Quit: thealphanerd)
04:15:11  * contrahaxquit (Quit: Sleeping)
04:16:13  * fallsemoquit (Read error: Operation timed out)
04:18:46  <dominictarr>ircretary, tell jjjohnny can you claim your feedopensource contribution: right now grumpy cat is getting the credit https://feedopensource.com/iteration/dominictarr/feedopensource/1PTAwipYpP63uNrcxfm5FewxRdZyar6ceu
04:18:46  <ircretary>dominictarr: I'll be sure to tell jjjohnny
04:23:48  * dominictarrquit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
04:24:37  * coderzachjoined
04:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 135]
04:28:38  <eugeneware>Is the testling local (npm install -g) binary supposed to work with local browsers too? I can only get it to work with phantomjs unless I hard code the loop to return headless = true at https://github.com/substack/testling/blob/master/bin/cmd.js#L213-L216
04:28:45  * coderzachquit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
04:28:59  <eugeneware>I *REALLY* want to alternative to karma for doing local testing :-)
04:35:47  * kevino80joined
04:35:49  <grncdr>eugeneware: are they on your path?
04:36:43  <eugeneware>yeah. When I run the browser-launcher module it can find them all. It's just that they all don't have the 'headless' var set in the JSON description, and so the code just serves up phantomjs.
04:38:09  <grncdr>oh I see
04:38:25  <grncdr>hm, that test for "headlessness" seems incorrect
04:39:01  <grncdr>as in, I don't understand why testling wants a headless browser, I guess substack would know
04:40:00  <grncdr>what about using the -bcmd option?
04:40:05  * kevino80quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
04:40:11  <grncdr>or -x
04:45:42  * fallsemojoined
04:56:27  * kumavis_quit (Quit: kumavis_)
04:56:49  * dguttmanquit (Quit: dguttman)
04:57:18  <eugeneware>grncdr: I wasn't sure what to pass through to the -x arg. It seemed like that was for additional cmd line options. Can I just pass in the full cmd line?
04:57:29  <grncdr>seems like it
04:57:34  <grncdr>it gets parsed and spawned
04:57:46  <grncdr>with an href argument appended to the en
04:57:47  <grncdr>d
05:00:45  * __rockbot__joined
05:01:04  * thealphanerdjoined
05:02:02  * joatesquit (Quit: Leaving)
05:02:02  * fallsemoquit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
05:02:24  <eugeneware>grncdr: That does work.
05:03:41  <eugeneware>But kind of defeats the purpose of browser detection though. And it looks like by default testling just returns the first headless browser it finds too. So perhaps I'm not understanding how the testling cmd line is supposed to be used? Or is this just an issue I should file on github?
05:07:07  * kumavis_joined
05:08:12  * dguttmanjoined
05:11:37  * thealphanerdquit (Quit: thealphanerd)
05:14:46  * ednapiranhajoined
05:18:59  * ednapiranhaquit (Client Quit)
05:20:21  * jxsonjoined
05:23:26  * cpupjoined
05:25:17  * coderzachjoined
05:26:14  <grncdr>probably github, I don't really know how it's supposed to work, just guessing from reading the source
05:26:55  <grncdr>eugeneware: actually, on re-reading your comment, I think it's working as intended
05:27:06  <grncdr>you should be able to use a short name for a browser (as long as it's on your path)
05:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 126]
05:28:20  <eugeneware>no, that didn't seem to work. Passing the short form to the -x arg didn't seem to work.
05:29:42  * coderzachquit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
05:29:56  <grncdr>hm, that's odd
05:30:04  * fallsemojoined
05:33:06  * __rockbot__quit (Quit: __rockbot__)
05:33:23  * __rockbot__joined
05:35:43  <eugeneware>reading cmd.js I think it just spawns the command passed through to it and then passes the URL as the param. So, I guess if the browser executables are in my path it would work. Though with mac, these are all in /Applications/Google Chrome.app/Resources/blah/blah
05:36:41  <eugeneware>the browser-launcher module detects all this stuff and the correct flags, etc. But nevermind, I'll file something in github. Thanks for your help.
05:44:25  * Maciek416quit (Remote host closed the connection)
05:46:37  * dguttmanquit (Quit: dguttman)
05:50:33  * kumavis_quit (Quit: kumavis_)
05:50:56  * kumavis_joined
05:52:55  * fallsemoquit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
05:53:13  * pfrazequit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
05:54:50  * fallsemojoined
05:56:47  * coderzachjoined
05:59:00  * dcodeIO1joined
06:00:07  * dcodeIOquit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
06:01:49  * coderzachquit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
06:01:51  * jxsonquit (Remote host closed the connection)
06:04:16  * thealphanerdjoined
06:04:20  <substack>eugeneware: I'm not very happy with how testling currently chooses which browser to use
06:04:36  <substack>I have some commits staged on browser-launcher to open up more of the configuration
06:04:41  * __rockbot__quit (Quit: __rockbot__)
06:05:04  <substack>I want it to work where you'll be able to `testling add browsername command`
06:05:18  <substack>and `testling list`, `testling set default browsername` etc
06:08:41  * fallsemoquit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
06:09:43  * thealphanerdquit (Quit: thealphanerd)
06:10:56  <nexxy>erm now the site is down for me...
06:11:01  <nexxy>http://feedopensource.com/
06:11:48  * maksimlinquit (Remote host closed the connection)
06:13:46  * contrahaxjoined
06:14:06  <eugeneware>substack: sounds awesome. And I guess `testling run browsername` too?
06:14:35  <eugeneware>Are there any plans to have it run on multiple browsers at a time in parallel or to keep the browsers open and a ws connection open like karma does? Or there another way you'd suggest for doing such things?
06:14:51  <eugeneware>nexxy: Yeah, been down for me for about 1/2 an hour or so.
06:14:57  <eugeneware>Active development :-)
06:15:42  <substack>eugeneware: that would be cool
06:18:28  <eugeneware>it could use your vm.runInNewContext shim thing to keep everything isolated potentially.
06:20:45  <contrahax>ogd think so?
06:20:58  <contrahax>i think 4 is my fav with 6 as a close second
06:27:51  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 131]
06:31:28  * ralphtheninjajoined
06:36:32  * kevino80joined
06:37:30  * ralphtheninjaquit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
06:38:18  <ogd>contrahax: 6 deserves its own domain, it is more universal
06:38:24  <ogd>contrahax: 4 is more nuanced
06:41:13  * kevino80quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
06:43:51  * marcello3djoined
06:47:24  * marcello3dquit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
06:47:59  * marcello3djoined
06:50:20  * tilgoviquit (Remote host closed the connection)
06:57:32  * coderzachjoined
06:59:12  * coderzac_joined
06:59:12  * coderzachquit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
07:03:27  * coderzac_quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
07:04:27  * thealphanerdjoined
07:14:31  * phatedjoined
07:21:07  * marcello3dquit (Remote host closed the connection)
07:21:42  * marcello3djoined
07:23:10  * thealphanerdquit (Quit: thealphanerd)
07:24:36  * AvianFluquit (Remote host closed the connection)
07:26:30  * marcello3dquit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
07:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 1, free: 143]
07:28:37  * collypopsquit (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz… *choke* ... *splutter* zzzZzZZzzz……)
07:29:26  * thealphanerdjoined
07:31:04  * joatesjoined
07:31:24  * shamajoined
07:31:51  * shamaquit (Remote host closed the connection)
07:31:58  * calvinfojoined
07:34:00  <juliangruber>substack: i'm having a hard time wrapping my head around `liver`
07:45:25  * mikolalysenkoquit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
07:50:22  <kumavis_>wat is going on here ? npm bug? (it wont serve the tgz) https://registry.npmjs.org/crdt/-/crdt-3.6.0.tgz
07:51:05  * dominictarrjoined
07:52:24  * marcello3djoined
07:53:36  <substack>juliangruber: when you render elements with data-start and data-end keys server-side, the browser automatically subscribes to updates to those ranges using level-livefeed and multilevel
07:54:30  <substack>so in your server code you can just db.createReadStream() and so long as you put data-{start,end} attributes into the html in the right places, all the page content will automatically live update
07:54:58  <juliangruber>substack: reading the readme the 2nd time it's much more clear
07:55:08  * AvianFlujoined
07:55:37  <substack>maybe I can add an introductory paragraph to set the context up to answer the "why" better
07:55:38  <juliangruber>that module's in a tough space to write "get it immediately" readmes for
07:55:44  <substack>yes
07:55:50  <juliangruber>yeah
07:55:54  <substack>glue modules are like that
07:56:16  <substack>it makes more sense too if you watch https://www.meteor.com/examples/leaderboard first
07:58:04  <juliangruber>i'd expect people to also wonder about the "modify the db from the client" part, for example how do you make it read only?
07:58:22  <substack>I linked to the multilevel docs for that
07:58:27  <juliangruber>i should probably add that to the multilevel readme and you can link to it
07:59:00  <juliangruber>aah i see, good
07:59:43  <juliangruber>how did you solve the problem where data would be written after the page is rendered but before the live updates start?
07:59:54  * coderzachjoined
08:00:00  <juliangruber>not a huge problem i guess but still
08:00:05  <substack>I haven't tackled that problem yet
08:00:18  <juliangruber>ok
08:00:22  <substack>but I have an idea for how I could solve it
08:00:48  <substack>or some ideas at least
08:01:29  <substack>another thing I want to figure out is how to buffer puts and deletes when the connection goes down
08:01:41  <juliangruber>i have some too but all have their implications
08:01:45  <substack>like replication but lighter weight
08:02:29  <juliangruber>yeah multilevel needs such a module
08:02:46  <juliangruber>i did something similar for reading when the connection is down: https://github.com/juliangruber/level-live-cache
08:02:56  <substack>another crazy idea I had was having pluggable extra kinds of data-* attributes
08:03:03  <substack>like data-edit to make elements editable
08:03:04  <juliangruber>i'm not sure if i implemented that well though, never really used it
08:03:11  <juliangruber>totally
08:03:44  <substack>I read through some of your modules for handling this kind of thing
08:03:48  * AvianFluquit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
08:03:58  <substack>like that port of one of tj's reactive component modules
08:04:12  <substack>but I didn't see how I could make that work in a node+browsers kind of way easily
08:04:38  * coderzachquit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
08:05:18  <substack>and I really want to just mostly think about how things will render server-side first and have everything upgrade relatively automatically in browser-land
08:05:50  <substack>because I like thinking in terms of mapping leveldb queries to html output
08:07:56  <substack>but perhaps we need another module that liver could plug into that would abstract away and generalize creating data-* handlers
08:08:13  <substack>and that base module would set up the multilevel instance for consumer modules
08:08:37  * marcello3dquit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
08:10:17  * jxsonjoined
08:10:37  * mikolalysenkojoined
08:15:11  * jxsonquit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
08:15:54  * mikolalysenkoquit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
08:19:07  <juliangruber>didn't you have one where you just wrote `data-key=key` and it would input data?
08:22:35  <substack>maybe hyperkey? that used a complicated back-and-forth with the server
08:22:42  <substack>but multilevel makes that all much simpler
08:23:29  <juliangruber>gotcha
08:25:12  * jxsonjoined
08:25:19  * jxsonquit (Remote host closed the connection)
08:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 57]
08:32:59  * indexzeroquit (Quit: indexzero)
08:33:58  * marcello3djoined
08:37:26  * kevino80joined
08:40:07  <dominictarr>kumavis, hey, whats wrong with [email protected]
08:41:07  <kumavis_>seems like it needs to republish? i couldn't install.
08:41:22  <kumavis_>{"error":"not_found","reason":"Document is missing attachment"}
08:41:36  <kumavis_> https://registry.npmjs.org/crdt/-/crdt-3.6.0.tgz
08:42:07  <kumavis_>installing 3.5.4 worked fine
08:42:18  * kevino80quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
08:42:39  <kumavis_>i think registry.npmjs is a bit messed up
08:47:56  <kumavis_>npm publish -f should fix it
08:50:52  * kumavis_quit (Quit: kumavis_)
08:50:56  * tobiejoined
08:51:13  * kumavis_joined
08:51:14  * peutetrejoined
08:53:06  * phatedquit (Remote host closed the connection)
08:55:26  * indexzerojoined
08:55:41  * tobiequit (Quit: tobie)
08:57:53  * peutetrequit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
08:58:50  * peutetrejoined
08:59:34  * calvinfoquit (Quit: Leaving.)
09:00:09  * marcello3dquit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
09:00:48  * coderzachjoined
09:00:52  * calvinfojoined
09:01:53  <dominictarr>feross, oh, hey - I switched to using native-buffer-browerify in sha.js and it's just as fast!
09:02:15  <feross>dominictarr: neat! i had a hunch that that would be the case
09:02:36  <feross>isn't it great? just as fast as Uint8Array but with the Buffer API, yay!
09:03:15  <feross>dominictarr: i was reading through your blog posts today
09:03:40  <feross>i like your philosophizing about software economic models. i hope the experiment works out!
09:05:04  * coderzachquit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
09:08:38  <kumavis_>dominictarr: did that solve it?
09:09:42  <eugeneware>juliangruber: fwiw, I've been working on leveldb live replication to data on the client, ala firebase. Here's the server: https://github.com/eugeneware/lively-examples/blob/master/webserver.js and here's the client (angularjs code): https://github.com/eugeneware/lively-examples/blob/master/app/scripts/app.js
09:10:01  <eugeneware>angularjs handles the data binding, however, though you could easily do this yourself.
09:11:02  <eugeneware>The underlying primitives are just node streams, so you can do the replication over a regular tcp stream as well.
09:11:27  * mikolalysenkojoined
09:14:53  * kumavis_quit (Quit: kumavis_)
09:16:24  * mikolalysenkoquit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
09:16:33  * calvinfoquit (Quit: Leaving.)
09:18:16  * eugenewarequit (Remote host closed the connection)
09:21:26  <dominictarr>kumavis, okay, I published it again, does it work now?
09:23:18  * contrahaxquit (Quit: Sleeping)
09:24:11  * marcello3djoined
09:27:35  * tobiejoined
09:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 1, free: 144]
09:30:43  * jcrugzzquit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
09:34:04  <dominictarr>feross, looks like I spoke a wee bit too soon... perf is a little unstable... seems like a GC thing maybe? some runs are good, others poor.
09:34:36  <feross>interesting
09:34:54  <feross>dominictarr: well, as more people use it, these things will get figured out
09:36:13  <dominictarr>wow, this is really weird - sha1 of 2.8 mb random data is slower than 10mg
09:36:14  <dominictarr>mb
09:37:04  <feross>dominictarr: slower *overall* or slower *per operation*?
09:37:43  <dominictarr>I mean it takes longer to hash the 2.8 mb load than the 10mb.
09:37:57  <dominictarr>but this is in a bench mark that does a bunch of increasing loads
09:38:07  <dominictarr>so probably something is interfering
09:38:49  <dominictarr>it's still better than better than most js crypto libs though.
09:41:53  <dominictarr>oops - benchmarking is hard - that's using node's buffer
09:48:26  <dominictarr>feross, okay so this is interesting: the benchmark is 3x slower that with Buffers, but if I only run the heavy case (and not the whole benchmark) then it's only a little worse.
09:48:45  <dominictarr>so, the benchmark is actually slowing it down, with GC or something?
09:48:53  * marcello3dquit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
09:51:35  * thealphanerdquit (Quit: thealphanerd)
09:53:03  <dominictarr>this is really weird. maybe it's caused by many things sharing a reference?
09:54:08  <dominictarr>js perf is sooooooo weird
09:56:53  * jcrugzzjoined
09:57:40  <joates>dominictarr: i have a Q about this line -> fos[method].apply(null, args.concat(function (err, data)
09:57:52  * ferossquit (Quit: feross)
09:59:10  <dominictarr>joates, that calls the api
09:59:20  <joates>seems there is no validation for args.length
09:59:21  <dominictarr>GET /iteration/$user/$repo/$wallet
09:59:48  <joates>yea but if i deliberately add another arg it will not get the cb() :(
10:00:09  <dominictarr>line 17
10:00:10  <joates>or am i incorrect to ssume that
10:00:18  <joates>*assume
10:01:10  * ralphtheninjajoined
10:01:14  * jcrugzzquit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
10:01:24  <dominictarr>just above that line it return next() if the length is wrong.
10:01:32  * coderzachjoined
10:02:06  <joates>ok, cool
10:03:42  * phatedjoined
10:05:06  * eugenewarejoined
10:05:08  * eugenewarequit (Remote host closed the connection)
10:05:19  * eugenewarejoined
10:05:29  * eugenewarequit (Remote host closed the connection)
10:05:54  * coderzachquit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
10:05:56  * eugenewarejoined
10:06:02  * eugenewarequit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
10:06:57  * eugenewarejoined
10:08:33  * phatedquit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
10:09:55  <guybrush>the new dev-tools crashes constantly for me :/
10:12:17  * mikolalysenkojoined
10:17:35  * mikolalysenkoquit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
10:17:53  <joates>dominictarr: this is what i meant -> http://i.imgur.com/ShXo8lw.png
10:18:41  <joates>it's the older version
10:19:16  <joates>that has the bug.. not a problem if ppl only use ./lib/auto-api
10:21:37  <dominictarr>joates, oh, oops - there is a check in the http api, but not in the cli api
10:25:11  <dominictarr>joates, okay, now there is a helpful error message
10:25:20  <joates>dominictarr: i really feel like i'm learning A LOT from studying yr code, all good stuff that i needed to learn :)
10:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 162]
10:34:54  <dominictarr>haha, great
10:38:24  * kevino80joined
10:43:01  * kevino80quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
10:46:33  * ferossjoined
10:46:46  * marcello3djoined
10:47:00  * tobiequit (Quit: tobie)
10:47:32  <feross>dominictarr: if you trace anything down to native-buffer-browserify, def send a PR
10:47:42  <feross>i'll keep improving it too
10:48:23  <feross>agreed tho: js perf is often unintuitive so running a lot of tests is key!
10:49:08  <dominictarr>feross, will do - crypto should be great for this because it's a real usecase and depends largely on writing & reading from memory and encodings
10:50:11  <feross>yeah, i also hope that webtorrent will be a really good test case since the bit torrent protocol creates a TON of buffers, both with file data and bencoded objects
10:51:00  * marcello3dquit (Ping timeout: 253 seconds)
10:54:20  * kevino80joined
10:55:26  * tobiejoined
10:56:25  * tobiequit
10:57:24  * tobiejoined
11:02:10  * coderzachjoined
11:06:41  * coderzachquit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
11:09:17  * kevino80quit (Remote host closed the connection)
11:11:41  * tobie_joined
11:12:03  * funkytekquit (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
11:12:54  * mikolalysenkojoined
11:13:31  <dominictarr>feross, I'm curious to see how https://mega.co.nz do it, because they have built a business around client side encryption
11:13:49  * tobie_quit (Client Quit)
11:17:57  * mikolalysenkoquit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
11:22:17  <dominictarr>feross, haha, they didn't minify the code, that makes security reviews easier!
11:22:51  * tobie_joined
11:22:51  * tobie_quit (Client Quit)
11:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 180]
11:28:12  <dominictarr>aha, they use stanford javascript crypto library
11:36:08  * ferossquit (Quit: feross)
11:44:50  <joates>dominictarr: ok no more PRs from me today.. going for lunch now.
11:45:02  * joateschanged nick to joates_lunch
11:47:29  * marcello3djoined
11:49:53  * fronxjoined
11:52:03  * marcello3dquit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
12:01:19  * fronxquit (Remote host closed the connection)
12:02:54  * coderzachjoined
12:07:27  * coderzachquit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
12:13:45  * mikolalysenkojoined
12:18:20  * dominictarrquit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
12:20:00  * mikolalysenkoquit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
12:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 135]
12:33:26  * jibay_quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
12:37:20  <ehd>Raynos: is xhr working alright in IE? i intend using it as an alternative to getting a giant browserified bundle
12:44:15  * fronxjoined
12:46:21  * eugenewarepart
12:47:20  * eugenewarejoined
12:48:13  * marcello3djoined
12:49:25  * fronxquit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
12:51:57  * yorickjoined
12:52:37  * marcello3dquit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
13:03:38  * coderzachjoined
13:08:10  * thlorenzjoined
13:08:12  * coderzachquit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
13:09:11  <substack>juliangruber: first part https://github.com/substack/attr-bind
13:11:09  * indexzeroquit (Quit: indexzero)
13:16:20  * mikolalysenkojoined
13:21:18  * mikolalysenkoquit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
13:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 159]
13:28:51  * fronxjoined
13:46:06  <eugeneware>substack: nice! that's my big issue with angularjs, lots of cool stuff but really needs to be broken into lots of small modules. And then they can ship a distribution if they want and call it a framework.
13:48:45  * marcello3djoined
13:50:41  * AvianFlujoined
13:52:55  * marcello3dquit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
14:02:52  * kevino80joined
14:04:25  * coderzachjoined
14:07:42  * thlorenzquit (Remote host closed the connection)
14:08:14  * thlorenzjoined
14:09:07  * coderzachquit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
14:09:53  * thlorenzquit (Remote host closed the connection)
14:10:34  * thlorenzjoined
14:13:11  * hoobdeeblaquit
14:17:13  * mikolalysenkojoined
14:22:09  * mikolalysenkoquit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
14:22:17  * joates_lunchchanged nick to joates
14:23:45  * thlorenzquit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
14:27:00  * coderzachjoined
14:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 163]
14:49:24  * pfrazejoined
14:49:27  * marcello3djoined
14:53:49  * Maciek416joined
14:54:27  * marcello3dquit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
14:55:25  * thlorenzjoined
14:59:56  * coderzachquit (Remote host closed the connection)
15:11:55  * AvianFluquit (Remote host closed the connection)
15:13:15  * mikolalysenkojoined
15:25:45  <substack>juliangruber: https://github.com/substack/attractor
15:25:57  <substack>grncdr, Raynos, eugeneware too ^^^
15:26:26  <substack>once the live example is done it should be somewhat compelling https://github.com/substack/attractor/tree/master/example/live
15:26:51  * fallsemojoined
15:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 2, free: 174]
15:28:16  * coderzachjoined
15:38:45  * fallsemoquit (Quit: Leaving.)
15:42:18  <ralphtheninja>substack: I like the multilevel-feed
15:42:26  * dguttmanjoined
15:42:34  <ralphtheninja>nice to abstract away the manifest
15:49:12  * kumavis_joined
15:50:14  * marcello3djoined
15:54:37  * kevino80quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
15:55:12  * marcello3dquit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
15:56:22  * kevino80joined
16:01:19  * kevino80quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
16:04:31  * kevino80joined
16:06:25  * AvianFlujoined
16:07:07  * kevinohara80joined
16:07:10  * kevino80quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
16:11:55  * fallsemojoined
16:16:57  * jcrugzzjoined
16:19:27  * kid_icarusjoined
16:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 177]
16:31:53  * eugenewarequit (Remote host closed the connection)
16:32:21  * eugenewarejoined
16:36:54  * eugenewarequit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
16:39:41  * kumavis_quit (Quit: kumavis_)
16:44:46  * marcello3djoined
16:48:45  * marcello3dquit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
16:49:15  <prettyrobots>http://www.nola.com/business/index.ssf/2014/01/bitcoin_digital_currency_is_st.html
16:51:52  * coderzachquit (Remote host closed the connection)
16:52:30  * coderzachjoined
16:53:19  * fallsemoquit (Quit: Leaving.)
16:56:51  * coderzachquit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
16:59:22  * kumavis_joined
17:04:17  * fallsemojoined
17:04:56  * marcello3djoined
17:08:12  <jesusabdullah>johnkpaul: New vf went live? Congrats ^5
17:09:01  <jesusabdullah>johnkpaul: Oh no 503s ;_; http://www.vanityfair.com/vf-hollywood/25-best-movies-about-hollywood
17:12:59  * coderzachjoined
17:21:50  * anvakaquit (Remote host closed the connection)
17:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 176]
17:42:43  * phatedjoined
17:43:56  * kevinohara80quit (Remote host closed the connection)
17:49:46  * ednapiranhajoined
17:51:20  * kevino80joined
17:52:31  * joatesquit (Quit: Leaving)
17:56:55  * calvinfojoined
17:58:42  * fronxquit (Remote host closed the connection)
17:59:40  * marcello3dquit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
18:02:00  * kumavis_quit (Quit: kumavis_)
18:03:29  * phatedquit (Remote host closed the connection)
18:06:01  * calvinfoquit (Quit: Leaving.)
18:06:51  * calvinfojoined
18:08:02  * coderzachquit (Remote host closed the connection)
18:08:29  * coderzachjoined
18:09:48  * AvianFluquit (Remote host closed the connection)
18:09:54  <chapel>http://blog.nodejs.org/2014/01/15/the-next-phase-of-node-js/index.html
18:11:03  * calvinfoquit (Client Quit)
18:11:50  * calvinfojoined
18:12:45  <rowbit>/!\ ATTENTION: (default-local) [email protected] successfully signed up for developer browserling plan ($20). Cash money! /!\
18:12:45  <rowbit>/!\ ATTENTION: (default-local) paid account successfully upgraded /!\
18:13:03  * coderzachquit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
18:13:28  * ednapiranhaquit (Quit: Leaving...)
18:15:47  * marcello3djoined
18:16:11  * calvinfoquit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
18:18:21  * phatedjoined
18:18:35  * mafintoshjoined
18:23:03  * thlorenzquit (Remote host closed the connection)
18:23:30  * ralphtheninjaquit (Quit: leaving)
18:23:53  * thlorenzjoined
18:24:29  * mafintoshquit (Quit: Leaving...)
18:27:51  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 102, free: 155]
18:29:30  * fronxjoined
18:33:11  * fotoveritejoined
18:34:23  * fronxquit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
18:40:54  * mafintoshjoined
18:46:17  <defunctzombie>paul_irish: ping
18:47:34  <Raynos>ehd: xhr was build with IE9 in mind
18:47:42  <Raynos>ehd: not sure about IE8 support, not production tested
18:48:23  <jesusabdullah>defunctzombie: you should borrow my parakeet for a few weeks
18:48:41  <defunctzombie>jesusabdullah: wut
18:48:55  <jesusabdullah>So I don't have to worry about finding him housing
18:48:56  <jesusabdullah>!
18:49:00  <defunctzombie>haha
18:49:08  <defunctzombie>I am leaving on Saturday :)
18:49:10  <jesusabdullah>You know how big a pain in the ass it's gonna be to convince an airbnb to let him stay??
18:49:13  <jesusabdullah>Where are you going?
18:49:18  <defunctzombie>Atlanta
18:49:21  <jesusabdullah>Also I won't be there until near the end of the month
18:49:23  <defunctzombie>for a bit to visit family
18:49:26  <jesusabdullah>oh nice
18:49:30  <jesusabdullah>Enjoy!
18:49:42  <defunctzombie>I think most places should be ok with birds.. maybe not airbnb
18:50:19  <jesusabdullah>Yeah, I mean, a bird is squarely in the "oh yeah no pets totally" category
18:50:23  <jesusabdullah>or at least, one of his size
18:50:36  <jesusabdullah>but subletting is a different experience
18:50:52  <jesusabdullah>I'm pretty sure Chipps just volunteered so we could be okay
18:52:35  <Raynos>why is npm a company ?
18:52:59  <phated>Raynos: yup
18:53:26  <defunctzombie>I don't think that was a yes or no question
18:53:28  * AvianFlujoined
18:54:29  * peutetrequit (Quit: peutetre)
18:54:36  <marcello3d>maybe because npm as not a company wasn't working?
18:55:25  <defunctzombie>haha
18:57:36  <creationix>I think js-git should become a company too
18:57:57  <creationix>well, not js-git itself, but a company who's core technology is js-git
18:58:01  <creationix>that makes products around it
18:58:19  <creationix>and everything will be open source, even the SaaS code
18:58:32  <creationix>just not sure it's wise to MIT license the backend to my product
18:58:58  <creationix>then anyone could take the code, change the name and launch a competing product for half the price
19:02:05  * eugenewarejoined
19:05:28  * coderzachjoined
19:06:29  * mafintoshquit (Quit: Leaving...)
19:06:56  <Raynos>I guess it wasn't working
19:07:23  * mikolalysenkoquit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
19:07:25  <Raynos>creationix: if someone can launch a competing product with the code alone
19:07:31  <Raynos>creationix: then the code is the only value you are providing
19:07:40  <Raynos>creationix: which basically means your not providing any value
19:07:41  <Raynos>:D
19:08:01  <creationix>Raynos, well, I am providing value, I write the code
19:08:06  <creationix>it's just that I give it away for free
19:08:10  <creationix>and charge for hosting it
19:08:26  <creationix>though maybe I could get a special deal with a hosting provider that would be harder for others to duplicate
19:08:52  <creationix>I want to trust people to not be jerks and outright steal my product
19:09:01  <creationix>but I don't want to enforce that by keeping the code private
19:09:22  <creationix>I guess I could modify the licence to disallow competing products, but that's murky
19:10:08  <chapel>there was that game site that open sourced everything
19:10:28  * mafintoshjoined
19:10:37  <creationix>on the bright side, most my customers are developers and potential developers
19:10:58  <creationix>they would understand that I worked hard to make this and would prefer my version over a clone that didn't add any value
19:11:06  <creationix>it's like using the original repo on github vs a fork
19:11:20  <creationix>unless of course the fork provided significant added value
19:12:18  * mikolalysenkojoined
19:14:26  <dguttman>mongo open sources their software, but makes money on support
19:14:43  <dguttman>their license is a bit weird though
19:14:48  <dguttman>drivers are Apache 2.0
19:14:54  <creationix>right, I could consult on js-git related stuff
19:15:04  <creationix>offer support contracts to companies using my tech, etc
19:15:26  <dguttman>http://www.mongodb.org/about/licensing/
19:17:03  <marcello3d>creationix: my suggestion would be to open source the platform but not the operational aspects for running a hosting provider
19:17:27  <creationix>marcello3d, yeah, that's what most people do, but I'd really like to open everything if possible
19:17:27  <marcello3d>if someone is smart enough to build that last piece by themselves, they'd be probably be a good contributor to the open source part
19:17:52  <marcello3d>plus you would be more trustworthy as a host than some knockoff company
19:18:24  <marcello3d>reliability is slightly more important than cost
19:18:31  * peutetrejoined
19:18:35  <creationix>yeah, trust is a big part, hmm
19:18:48  <creationix>I'd need a github oauth key for parts of the service
19:18:54  <grncdr>creationix: I'm trying to remember, did you previously work on a git-based "package manager"
19:18:55  <creationix>so they would be trusting me to not abuse the key
19:19:18  <creationix>grncdr, mostly ideas, but a new one would be part of this platform/product
19:19:32  <grncdr>it's something that came up the other day
19:19:48  <grncdr>in a different conversation, but I would like that
19:21:39  <creationix>grncdr, the unsolved parts are around having a central server with a single namespace or a distributed system
19:21:56  <creationix>allowing arbitrary git urls for dependencies introduces multiple points of failure
19:21:58  <grncdr>I feel like the tarball-as-a-method-of-code-distribution is inferior
19:21:58  <grncdr>I wish it was socially acceptable to publish npm packages that just refer to commit hashes for everything (including deps)
19:21:58  <grncdr>distributed
19:22:21  <creationix>grncdr, I would love a global hash database
19:22:28  <marcello3d>creationix: the other thing to keep in mind is a project like this will be ever evolving, you'll have the biggest advantage of setting the roadmap and skating to where the puck will be, to be cliched
19:22:29  <creationix>where you can store values and retrieve values by hash
19:22:43  <marcello3d>creationix: it's not going to be something you build once and you're done and people rip it off.
19:22:58  <grncdr>solved it! :D
19:22:58  <grncdr>true
19:22:58  <grncdr>relying on a single registry introduces a SPOF
19:22:58  <grncdr>here's a fun thought: an index of commit hashes to other locations
19:23:06  <creationix>marcello3d, right, the only real threat is some established company with 10x more resources taking it and running past me
19:23:07  <grncdr>haha
19:23:44  <marcello3d>if you're worried about that, put some money into patents and lawyers ;)
19:23:58  <marcello3d>you're more likely to get acquired by said big company than for it to be a threat
19:24:00  <creationix>but that's the thing, I don't want to have to enforce using license and law
19:24:06  <grncdr>we were saying the same thing at the same time I guess… but yeah, I don't see any reason you couldn't have a registry (or hundreds of registries) that just store <hash> -> (location, ...) tuples
19:24:08  <creationix>I want people to naturally want to play nice
19:24:48  <marcello3d>hard to do that in business...
19:25:47  <creationix>marcello3d, right, but why would they aquire me if they could get all the value for free
19:26:04  <creationix>I always try to write software in a way that it would be useful without me
19:26:17  <creationix>I guess the customer base I would own
19:26:20  <creationix>and the social status
19:26:21  <marcello3d>sure, but they wouldn't be able to bring it to the next stage without your thought processes
19:26:46  <marcello3d>an acquisition of that type would be as much about hiring you as the project
19:26:56  <marcello3d>unless you were huge
19:27:03  <grncdr>I do think the customer base / network is non-trivial as well
19:27:12  <marcello3d>yea
19:27:23  <marcello3d>I mean, have you seen scenarios like you've described?
19:27:38  <marcello3d>where an open source company goes out of business because some big company rips it off?
19:27:42  <creationix>like I said, all the SaaS companies I've worked with keep their core infrastructure private
19:27:50  <rowbit>Daily usage stats: [developer: 119, free: 2544]
19:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 231, free: 127]
19:27:53  <marcello3d>I feel like you're more likely to go out of business because you can't get enough revenue
19:27:57  <creationix>because they don't want to be vunerable while starting up
19:28:18  <creationix>marcello3d, right, thanks for that reminder
19:28:31  <creationix>I guess I've been infected some by the tocis startup culture
19:28:38  <creationix>*toxic
19:29:00  <marcello3d>you have to decide what's a bigger priority to you, providing this open source project to the world for free, or building a business
19:29:10  <marcello3d>you can probably do some combination, but there will be compromise
19:30:23  <creationix>marcello3d, I guess I'll just focus on keeping the company alive while staying true to my open source roots
19:30:36  <creationix>and being honest and fair with customers
19:31:00  <marcello3d>definitely
19:31:09  <marcello3d>and don't be afraid to charge for a product
19:31:59  <marcello3d>for me I like open source over closed source because there's less dependency on another company, if something goes wrong you can always fall back on trying to fix it yourself
19:32:33  <creationix>yep
19:32:39  <Raynos>Also consider pay what you want
19:32:41  <marcello3d>I think the same applies for hosting providers, you don't necessarily want to be reliant on nodejitsu or heroku or even amazon, you want to be able to switch hosting providers if they go south
19:32:44  <Raynos>I pay money for free games all the time
19:33:06  <Raynos>but im also one of the few people that pays money for a text editor where as most people are too cheap for that :/
19:33:29  <creationix>Raynos, right, but there enough of you?
19:33:45  <creationix>and I have to charge something monthly when hosting fees are incurred
19:34:00  <Raynos>i pay for testling & github and others too
19:34:07  <Raynos>i dont know how many of me there are
19:34:13  <creationix>yeah, I don't pay for any of those
19:34:18  <marcello3d>I pay for github, though it feels like a rip off for the amount I use the private features ;D
19:34:24  <creationix>though I did buy a sublime and textmate license after using them for a year each
19:34:50  <marcello3d>you are not a business, though, businesses will spend money to avoid making shit themselves
19:34:55  <creationix>and I pay $40/month to linode
19:35:18  <creationix>my linodes tend to stay 99.9% idle
19:35:28  <creationix>since I write very effecient code and have relatively little traffic
19:38:27  <marcello3d>running a business is complicated and hard. especially if you've never done it before. that's part of the reason people get VC, gives them more room for error/learning
19:38:54  <creationix>anybody know some VC's willing to help with a seed round
19:41:41  <dguttman>creationix: I might
19:41:44  <creationix>or better, someone willing to partner and help with the business side
19:42:57  * fronxjoined
19:47:18  <ehd>Raynos: I'll give it a
19:47:40  * fronxquit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
19:47:44  <ehd>*try, wrapping http and xhr in a simple wrapper
19:48:15  <ehd>Unless someone already did that in a minimalistic way
19:48:38  <Raynos>ehd: ?
19:48:40  <Raynos>I see
19:48:50  <Raynos>ehd: I just use xhr in the browser & request in the server
19:48:56  <Raynos>ehd: xhr & request have a minimal shared api
19:49:11  <ehd>I want to require the same module and get a small browser infield bundle
19:49:41  <ehd>*browserified. Time to kill autocorrect
19:58:13  * kevino80quit (Remote host closed the connection)
19:58:22  <Raynos>ehd: oh that's bad because the interfaces would be different
19:58:36  <Raynos>ehd: it might be interested to build the xhr interface backed by request, I'll merge a PR of that into xhr
19:59:25  * kevino80joined
19:59:33  * mikolalysenkoquit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
19:59:44  * jxsonjoined
20:00:21  * jxsonquit (Remote host closed the connection)
20:00:37  <ehd>think it would make sense to default to the request interface and pick the browser xhr based on the browser field in package.json?
20:01:13  * jxsonjoined
20:01:25  <ehd>my main aim is simply being able to require the same thing, get a small browser bundle and have consistent apis
20:03:41  <Raynos>ehd: the problem is the request api surface is far bigger then xhr
20:04:05  <ehd>yah that's why i'd carefully wrap that
20:04:08  <Raynos>ehd: so it needs to default to xhr as it has less features and re-implement just the features xhr supports but backed by mikeal/request in node
20:04:19  <Raynos>but again its fine to add this to raynos/xhr itself
20:04:28  <Raynos>so you can just `require('xhr')` and it works in node
20:04:49  <Raynos>apart from the cross origin flag stuff. which you dont need in node
20:07:09  <Raynos>substack: attractor looks cool, I just dont like two way data binding :(
20:07:38  * mafintoshquit (Quit: Leaving...)
20:07:41  <substack>Raynos: data binding seems kind of useless to me, I just put it there because people think they need a framework to do it
20:09:23  <substack>Raynos: very soon I'll have the live updating meteor-style example I made for liver working in this attractor style
20:11:00  <Raynos>substack: https://gist.github.com/Raynos/3355703 from one year ago :p
20:11:43  <Raynos>I would update it, if I cared :/
20:14:49  * mafintosjoined
20:14:57  * contrahaxjoined
20:18:16  <ehd>Raynos: how would you detect between node and browser?
20:18:30  <Raynos>ehd: browser field in xhr module
20:18:35  <ehd>(inside xhr's index.js or pakcage.json or whatever)
20:18:41  <Raynos>default to node and use browser field to use browser file for browsers
20:18:42  <Raynos>also
20:19:09  <ehd>right, cool
20:19:16  <Raynos>thats the best option
20:19:20  <Raynos>the other options are worse
20:19:54  <ehd>yes, i agree. havent tried any of the newer transform modules anyway
20:20:24  <ehd>browser field spec was that gist by defunctzombie right
20:20:42  <defunctzombie>ehd: yes
20:21:24  <ehd>cool, was just wondering whether it lived somewhere else by now
20:22:29  <defunctzombie>ehd: nope
20:22:33  <defunctzombie>ehd: tho it probably should
20:22:56  <defunctzombie>maybe with a larger guide about various package.json fields
20:23:04  <ehd>yeah
20:23:28  <ehd>or in the readme of the module implementing that
20:23:31  <Raynos>thats a good idea
20:23:34  <ehd>spec close to code
20:23:36  <Raynos>having a package-ext module
20:23:41  <Raynos>that documents all extra fields
20:23:46  <Raynos>and the modules that consume them
20:24:00  <defunctzombie>not even a module.. just a damn readme :)
20:24:09  <ehd>:D
20:24:48  <Raynos>yes
20:24:52  <Raynos>a readme and a git repo
20:24:58  <defunctzombie>yep
20:25:06  <defunctzombie>that's all I need to survive in the wilderness
20:25:10  <defunctzombie>a readme and a git repo
20:25:47  <ehd>well it's your gist.. go for it :D
20:26:04  <ehd>PRs will come along
20:26:31  <ehd>and people will have weird new ideas for additional package.json fields all of a sudden
20:26:38  <defunctzombie>do we not have this yet?
20:26:47  <defunctzombie>no repo or place that we point people to about package.json?
20:27:03  <defunctzombie>first two results on google
20:27:06  <ehd>i don't know. i only know `npm help json`
20:27:07  <defunctzombie>first is npm
20:27:10  <defunctzombie>and second is http://package.json.nodejitsu.com/
20:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 1, free: 129]
20:49:08  * jcrugzzquit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
20:59:31  * mafintosquit (Quit: Leaving...)
21:00:01  * defunctzombiechanged nick to defunctzombie_zz
21:06:02  * mikolalysenkojoined
21:07:32  * contrahaxquit (Quit: Sleeping)
21:08:02  * mafintoshjoined
21:10:29  * mikolalysenkoquit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
21:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 145]
21:28:19  <paul_irish>defunctzombie_zz: sup
21:28:35  <paul_irish>defunctzombie_zz: PM me. i'll get it even if i'm AFK
21:29:18  * eugenewarequit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
21:34:23  * eugenewarejoined
21:36:03  <jesusabdullah>ogd: `cool.faces` best API ever
21:36:09  <jesusabdullah>ogd: also bonus points for stream lol
21:36:21  <ogd>yea its the best module on npm now thx to all the pull reqs
21:36:30  <ogd>needs an irc bot tho
21:36:46  <jesusabdullah>look at your dependents
21:36:48  <jesusabdullah>g2g
21:37:13  <jesusabdullah>https://npmjs.org/package/hubot-cool-ascii-faces
21:40:37  * contrahaxjoined
21:46:23  * phatedquit (Remote host closed the connection)
21:48:03  * contrahaxquit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
21:49:10  * ralphtheninjajoined
21:52:57  * mafintoshquit (Quit: Leaving...)
21:56:39  * thealphanerdjoined
21:57:12  * peutetrequit (Quit: peutetre)
21:57:43  * eugenewarequit (Remote host closed the connection)
21:58:15  * eugenewarejoined
21:59:51  * jcrugzzjoined
22:00:07  * eugenewarequit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
22:00:26  * eugenewarejoined
22:03:25  * contrahaxjoined
22:09:35  <prettyrobots>Is it really 27 degrees in Oakland?
22:10:06  <prettyrobots>And why is it 68 in Cupertino? How did Apple swing that?
22:10:49  <ogd>its like 70 in oakland
22:11:11  <ogd>could be 27c
22:16:51  * mafintosjoined
22:17:41  * funkytekjoined
22:19:36  * thealphanerdquit (Quit: thealphanerd)
22:21:56  * mafintosquit (Quit: Leaving...)
22:22:50  * peutetrejoined
22:23:54  <prettyrobots>ogd: 27 and flurries
22:24:39  <prettyrobots>Must have configured the wrong Oakland. I tired again and it says 75.
22:25:47  <grncdr>it is definitely nice weather in Oakland right now :D
22:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 1, free: 139]
22:29:08  * mafintoshjoined
22:29:37  * jxsonquit (Remote host closed the connection)
22:30:29  * fronxjoined
22:30:35  * collypopsjoined
22:30:56  <Domenic_>What should the streams spec logo be
22:31:16  <Domenic_>In the style of these guys http://spec.whatwg.org/
22:32:42  <Domenic_>e.g. http://resources.whatwg.org/logo-dom.svg http://resources.whatwg.org/logo-fullscreen.svg http://resources.whatwg.org/logo-encoding.svg
22:32:48  <Raynos>Domenic_: a circle with a pipe in it
22:32:57  * fronxquit (Read error: Operation timed out)
22:32:58  <Domenic_>I think I agree
22:33:02  <Domenic_>Like a mario pipe or a smoking pipe
22:33:03  <Raynos>or maybe a circle with a duplex telephone
22:33:08  <Raynos>Like a mario pipe
22:35:14  * mafintoshquit (Quit: Leaving...)
22:35:27  <grncdr>what is streams spec?
22:37:54  * coderzachquit (Remote host closed the connection)
22:39:03  * kevino80quit
22:39:28  * phatedjoined
22:40:07  * thealphanerdjoined
22:48:28  <prettyrobots>The more net neutrality erodes, he more likely we're going to find ourselves wanting to have distributed networks.
22:48:49  <marcello3d>maybe something like ==]==
22:50:12  * collypopsquit (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
22:50:33  * collypopsjoined
22:56:40  * AvianFluquit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
23:00:10  * jxsonjoined
23:00:13  <grncdr>man, I don't know how I ever wrote javascript without npm
23:00:57  <grncdr>+ browserify
23:04:59  * jxsonquit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
23:06:03  <chapel>jquery!
23:06:04  <chapel>:P
23:06:11  <marcello3d>text editor?
23:09:51  <Raynos>grncdr: the global module pattern
23:10:31  <grncdr>ha
23:10:54  <grncdr>I was talking more about npm install —save that-thing-I-need
23:10:58  <Raynos>(function (require, exports) { var dep = require('dep'); var MY_MODULE = {}; MY_MODULE.method = function () {}; exports.MY_NAME = MY_MODULE; }(function r(k) { return window[k] }, window));
23:11:21  * contrahaxquit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
23:11:24  * chrisdickinson_joined
23:11:59  * ELLIOTTCABLE__joined
23:12:09  * contrahaxjoined
23:12:40  <Raynos>grncdr: `function install() { cp ~/my-stuff/$1 ./scripts/$1 }`
23:14:36  * philipn_joined
23:14:42  * ralphthe1injajoined
23:15:09  <grncdr>hm, good point
23:15:21  * Maciek416_joined
23:15:22  <grncdr>couple of bash scripts and I won't need any of this crap
23:15:25  <grncdr>:P
23:15:28  * farnsworth_joined
23:16:25  * mk30_joined
23:16:38  <grncdr>of course, where does the "stuff" in ~/my-stuff/ come from....?
23:16:49  <grncdr>I guess I will just write everything I need ever ;)
23:17:08  * chrisdickinsonquit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
23:17:08  * ELLIOTTCABLE_quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
23:17:08  * ircretaryquit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
23:17:08  * ircretaryjoined
23:17:09  * philipnquit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
23:17:10  * prettyrobots_quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
23:17:10  * funkytekquit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
23:17:10  * jgpelletierquit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
23:17:10  * niftylettucequit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
23:17:10  * Maciek416quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
23:17:10  * farnsworthquit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
23:17:11  * ralphtheninjaquit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
23:17:11  * mk30quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
23:17:11  * jgpelletierjoined
23:17:12  * machtyquit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
23:17:12  * prettyrobotsquit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
23:17:13  * farnsworth_changed nick to farnsworth
23:17:22  * ELLIOTTCABLE__changed nick to ELLIOTTCABLE_
23:17:30  * prettyrobotsjoined
23:17:31  * Maciek416_changed nick to Maciek416
23:17:32  * prettyrobots_joined
23:17:35  * peutetrequit (Quit: peutetre)
23:17:55  * prettyrobotschanged nick to Guest96363
23:18:00  * prettyrobots_changed nick to Guest15129
23:18:15  * machtyjoined
23:19:59  * chrisdickinson_changed nick to chrisdickinson
23:20:20  * Guest96363changed nick to prettyrobots
23:20:27  * coderzachjoined
23:22:47  * niftylettucejoined
23:27:09  * hoobdeeblajoined
23:27:19  * AvianPhonejoined
23:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 138]
23:28:51  * ralphthe1injachanged nick to ralphtheninja
23:30:45  * fronxjoined
23:30:56  * thlorenzquit (Remote host closed the connection)
23:31:40  * jcrugzzquit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
23:35:24  * fronxquit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
23:36:15  * calvinfojoined
23:37:48  * thealphanerdquit (Quit: thealphanerd)
23:38:41  * thealphanerdjoined
23:38:49  * thealphanerdquit (Client Quit)
23:50:30  * funkytekjoined
23:51:06  <mmckegg>Any one know if there is a way to specify the readme (other than README.md) that appears on npmjs.org? I'm wanting to pull request a JS lib into supporting NPM and browserify so would like the package.json to point to a different readme than the default.
23:56:28  <Raynos>mmckegg: do a PR on this https://github.com/npm/read-package-json/blob/master/read-json.js#L230
23:57:00  <Raynos>mmckeg: the easier thing is `{ "scripts": { "prepublish": "mv lol.md README.md" } }`
23:58:30  <mmckegg>yeah, there's that. I wish people would just write decent github READMEs then this wouldn't be a problem :)