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00:26:51  <rowbit1>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 8, free: 14]
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00:59:14  <thlorenz>Raynos: The --no-optional argument will prevent optional dependencies from being installed.
00:59:38  <thlorenz>Just discovered that via the twitters
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00:59:51  <thlorenz>that'd solve your problem and should probably be the default
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01:06:34  <jesusabdullah>https://groups.google.com/forum/?hl=en?hl%3Den#!topic/nodejs/oHQB3fft8zg
01:06:36  <jesusabdullah>hehehehe
01:06:39  <jesusabdullah>I'm a jerk
01:06:50  <jesusabdullah>that said: hehehehe
01:07:46  <jesusabdullah>I should make a bot that procedurally generates nodejs mailing list posts
01:08:19  <guybrush>is twitter/airportyh in here?
01:10:35  <paul_irish>I don't think i've seen toby around irc
01:11:16  <guybrush>oh ok :/
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01:25:15  <dlmanning>ogd: ping
01:26:51  <rowbit1>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 15]
01:28:06  <ogd>dlmanning: ahoy
01:28:28  <ogd>guybrush: airportyh has been hanging in here recently, just not now
01:29:37  <dlmanning>ogd: So I hear you saying that you want to fight me ;)
01:29:49  <guybrush>kk, just wanted to ask about npmcomponent since some packages are missing
01:29:49  <ogd>haha not really
01:30:44  <Raynos>thlorenz: peerdeps are optional? :S
01:30:57  <dlmanning>ogd: So it's not that I care overmuch about my crappy little browserify transform
01:30:59  <Wraithan>fight fight fight fight
01:31:36  * Wraithankids
01:31:38  <dlmanning>But there aren't any really great ways (that I could think of) to make sure that the compiled module has its dependencies
01:32:28  <ogd>dlmanning: in your case handlebars is a plugin right?
01:32:40  <dlmanning>Not handlebars itself
01:33:26  <ogd>so why can't handlebars be a dependency?
01:34:15  <dlmanning>ogd: Because then my the transform would need to expose the functionality in Bad Way
01:34:50  <ogd>dlmanning: im not sure i understand the context now, do you have a link to the module you are referring to?
01:35:01  <dlmanning>https://github.com/dlmanning/browserify-handlebars
01:36:41  <ogd>ok so in the context of that module why can't handlebars be a dependency?
01:36:51  <ogd>e.g. what does 'Bad Way' mean exactly?
01:37:56  <dlmanning>Well it can, but then the compiled module (which functions at the project level), would need to refer to the internal dependency tree of the browserify-handlebars module
01:38:38  <dlmanning>And it seems odd to have packages effectively exporting multiple resources into a project
01:39:10  <dlmanning>peerDep seems more naturally suited to the problem
01:39:15  <ogd>'compiled module' means the browserify bundle?
01:39:49  <dlmanning>No, it's the precompiled handlebars templates
01:40:34  <dlmanning>The plugin precompiles the templates and includes that module with the runtime (not the full handlebars module) in the browserify bundle
01:40:39  <ogd>oh so at transform time you require('handlebars') to use .precompile but then the browserify bundle includes enough to run require("handlebars/runtime")
01:41:27  <dlmanning>^ I think the last thing I typed answers that
01:43:10  <ogd>still trying to fully understand it. is it that browserify wouldn't be able to resolve 'require("handlebars/runtime")'
01:43:48  <dlmanning>It wouldn't if handlebars were only a dependency of browserify-handlebars
01:44:20  <dlmanning>It needs to be a dep of the project being browserified
01:44:26  <ogd>ok gotcha
01:44:42  <ogd>so IMO your project should still have handlebars as a dep because of this line https://github.com/dlmanning/browserify-handlebars/blob/master/index.js#L20
01:45:16  <dlmanning>ogd: That's a good observation. I agree
01:45:39  <dlmanning>And that's an oversight
01:45:43  <ogd>as for the runtime i can see where you're coming from
01:46:21  <dlmanning>Cool
01:46:39  <dlmanning>So, if peerDeps causes so much chaos that it needs to be yanked, so be it
01:46:51  <dlmanning>But I'll have to replace it with something (equally?) janky
01:47:22  <ogd>my gut reaction is that browserify-handlebars should be injecting a known working version of the handlebars runtime
01:47:35  <dlmanning>See I kinda wanted to avoid that
01:47:42  <dlmanning>Cause I did that first
01:48:21  <dlmanning>But then I thought I'd put my trust in semvar (and kpdecker)
01:48:52  <dlmanning>So users of the plugin get an up-to-date version of handlebars without me having to update the module whenever handlebars releases a point update
01:49:23  <ogd>gotcha, I use * or ^ for addressing that
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01:49:35  <ogd>sorry not * but ~
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01:50:02  <dlmanning>Right, but it wouldn't work if I packaged the runtime in my module
01:50:06  <thlorenz>Raynos: peerdeps installing is optional
01:51:16  <ogd>dlmanning: couldn't you just have handlebars: ^2.0.0 in your package.json?
01:52:29  <dlmanning>ogd: Sure, but then the compiled template module would have to reach down into the internal dependency tree of browserify-handlebars, and we're back to single modules effectively exporting multiple deps
01:52:53  <ogd>oh i meant in the version of browserify-handlebars where you injected the runtime rather than depending on browserify to do it
01:54:03  <ogd>ah but the downside of that approach is that multiple copies of the runtime would get included
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01:55:39  <dlmanning>yeah
01:56:34  <ogd>dlmanning: thanks for explaining. i now think you are using peerdeps as they are intended
01:56:41  <dlmanning>haha, well thanks
01:56:53  <dlmanning><3
01:57:13  <dlmanning>Thanks for listening
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02:26:51  <rowbit1>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 6]
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02:37:17  <rowbit1>substack, pkrumins: Encoders down: 50.57.72.69 (free7)
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03:33:17  <rowbit1>substack, pkrumins: Encoders down: 50.57.72.69 (free7)
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03:51:04  <dominictarr>jjjohnny: hey - nah I don't think that fos needs to be a protocol - maybe there is a protocol in there but it should be more general
03:51:15  <dominictarr>isaacs: ping2
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04:26:51  <rowbit1>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 1, free: 12]
04:34:08  <dominictarr>substack: btw have you tried the latest [email protected]? it's refactored a lot. Most features are removed, but core is getting very tight
04:34:58  <dominictarr>It caches modules more intelligently than stock npm, and in such a way that offline works much better, even for http/giturls
04:35:15  <substack>cool, I'll pull the latest
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04:37:21  <dominictarr>it doesn't have sync anymore either - that was kinda annoying - I'm gonna separate out the sync part into a server
04:37:43  <dominictarr>and that will become just another way you can resolve things.
04:38:10  <substack>makes sense
04:38:51  <dominictarr>the most annoying thing about [email protected] was when you tried to install something but it hadn't synced yet
04:38:56  <dominictarr>that is gone
04:39:52  <substack>when you abstract the sync part into a server, will the client be able to have multiple servers?
04:40:26  <substack>so if we're both offline but create an ad-hoc network I can pull modules from your npmd
04:40:46  <dominictarr>it will just be a "resolve server" you'll do a json post to it to tell it what you want to install, it will send you a tree
04:40:54  <substack>even better: if I could push my staged modules to you and when you get online my package will show up on the public npm
04:41:08  <substack>because I signed it with my public key
04:41:22  <substack>but that will take some changes to the primary npm
04:41:35  <dominictarr>then you request what you don't have by shasum and it will send it to you as multipart or a tar or something
04:41:47  <substack>cool
04:41:56  <substack>ok built the latest version
04:42:05  <dominictarr>substack: yeah, that wouldn't be very secure until we have signed packages
04:43:14  <dominictarr>substack: we'll need some new protocols to get to a _fully_ p2p pm
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04:43:41  <jjjohnny>dominictarr: installed on third attempt
04:44:11  <dominictarr>jjjohnny: 3rd?
04:44:22  <jjjohnny>yeah got a lot of errors first two
04:44:34  <dominictarr>what sort of errors?
04:44:51  <jjjohnny>some fstat errors, i remember
04:45:00  <jjjohnny>or lstat
04:46:40  <jjjohnny>seems to be working fine tho
04:47:03  <dominictarr>jjjohnny: this where npm errors?
04:47:18  <jjjohnny>yeah
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04:56:57  <dominictarr>substack: people discussing riding from seattle to toorcamp https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/toorcamp/ap4QeyvS8Zg
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05:06:24  <jjjohnny>substack: did you submit to cascasia.js?
05:06:55  <jjjohnny>cashcashier.js
05:07:19  <substack>nope
05:07:37  <substack>I'll be in NZ
05:20:21  <jjjohnny>dominictarr: what did you propose to em?
05:23:55  <dominictarr>jjjohnny: "the history of node.js streams"
05:26:51  <rowbit1>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 5, free: 19]
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06:02:06  <dominictarr>substack: I'm adding range support to level search... but should I store dates as unix times or as strings?
06:03:13  <substack>well timestamps aren't lexicographically sortable without transformation
06:03:16  <substack>because they are integers
06:03:25  <substack>but iso8601 dates are sortable
06:03:55  <substack>and you can inspect them too
06:04:00  <substack>but it gets tricky with timezones
06:05:23  <dominictarr>JSON.stringify(date) is sortable
06:05:42  <substack>yes it's iso8601 or thereabouts
06:06:07  <dominictarr>this all gets bytewise encoded so unix or iso are both sortable
06:06:18  <substack>oh!
06:06:30  <substack>if it's encoded with bytewise then I would actually lean toward integers
06:06:42  <substack>but I'm not sure why
06:07:06  <substack>that's just what my fast heuristic brain that can't explain itself is telling me
06:07:21  <dominictarr>yeah - it's less bytes and that is better for indexes.
06:08:09  <dominictarr>since bytewise is not human readable anyway, then there is no advantage to putting a human readable encoding inside of it.
06:08:15  <dominictarr>okay cool.
06:09:28  <dominictarr>in both ways you loose the timezone... but I don't want to get into that mess...
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06:10:50  <dominictarr>ralphtheninja: yo!
06:21:30  <dominictarr>substack: hmm, no I think it should be indexed as json - because that is what it will become when it's saved
06:21:42  <dominictarr>so if it was reindexed it would become strings so it would be wrong.
06:26:51  <rowbit1>Daily usage stats: [developer: 5, free: 42]
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08:05:48  <rowbit1>substack, pkrumins: A developer is waiting in the queue for undefined/undefined
08:07:58  <wolfeidau>lol
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09:18:08  <mmalecki>substack: *loving* clocker
09:18:35  <mmalecki>substack: I can work with no internet access, which wasn't possible with harvest
09:18:46  <mmalecki>substack: and it's CLI
09:26:51  <rowbit1>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 8, free: 53]
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09:43:59  <substack>mmalecki: excellent!
09:44:03  <substack>and it's like, hardly any code
09:45:25  <mmalecki>yeah, that's the best thing about it
09:45:39  <mmalecki>it's really UNIX :)
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10:16:18  <dominictarr>TODO: make npmd-build cache builds, so you only have to compile once per [email protected]/[email protected]
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10:47:01  <dominictarr>substack: json-stable-stringify doesn't handle Date correctly.
10:47:37  <dominictarr>pull request coming...
10:51:09  <dominictarr>substack: on no... maybe it does.
10:51:16  <dominictarr>turns out it does...
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11:26:51  <rowbit1>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 5, free: 42, node10: 0]
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13:08:21  <ins0mnia>ogd: is it possible for you to bump version filereader-stream? npm for some weird reason still fetches the "old" 0.0.1 version
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13:58:06  <airportyh>defunctzombie_zz: fyi I am working on browserify search today
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14:26:52  <rowbit1>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 65, node10: 0]
14:32:36  * defunctzombie_zzchanged nick to defunctzombie
14:45:12  <defunctzombie>airportyh: cool
14:45:20  <defunctzombie>airportyh: I got in to NYC yesterday very late
14:45:23  <defunctzombie>so I am all over the place today
14:45:33  <defunctzombie>but might hop on and do some work soon
14:45:34  <airportyh>alright
14:45:55  <airportyh>I enhanced the www a little
14:46:37  <airportyh>added bootstrap buttons and icons
14:46:43  <airportyh>and client-side routing
14:48:16  <defunctzombie>cool
14:48:33  <defunctzombie>for icons I typically use icomoon cause you can build whatever icon set you want
14:48:57  <defunctzombie>less limiting than using the predefined sets people like to pimp out
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14:52:11  <airportyh>defunctzombie: cool didn't know about that
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14:52:42  <airportyh>defunctzombie: I didn't know what icon to use for dependents count, so I just used a heart
14:52:51  <defunctzombie>haha
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15:00:34  <airportyh>defunctzombie: btw I forked queue to make it start by itself https://github.com/airportyh/queue
15:00:54  <defunctzombie>cool
15:00:59  <airportyh>so you can keep pushing jobs to it after it has stopped
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15:26:52  <rowbit1>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 41, node10: 0]
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15:36:32  <juliangruber>is there a way to asynchronously write to stdout in node?
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16:03:37  <airportyh>defunctzombie: how do you feel about using npmd to speed up testing?
16:03:51  <defunctzombie>airportyh: how does that speed it up?
16:04:02  <ogd>ins0mnia: done
16:04:35  <airportyh>defunctzombie: smarter caching
16:04:49  <defunctzombie>airportyh: does npmd actually work?
16:04:54  <airportyh>defunctzombie: I guess I'll have to try to find out
16:04:58  <defunctzombie>airportyh: also, check out npm-install
16:05:07  <defunctzombie>which iirc I added caching
16:05:26  <defunctzombie>airportyh: I am good with using anything that works and helps
16:05:34  <defunctzombie>once we get things running
16:07:57  <airportyh>npm-install is just docs right?
16:08:01  <airportyh>or a module?
16:08:54  * flobypart
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16:13:01  <defunctzombie>airportyh: module
16:13:16  <defunctzombie>airportyh: a module I wrote to do non-deduped npm installs
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16:13:21  <defunctzombie>and it has a caching layer
16:13:31  <defunctzombie>airportyh: also.. did I give you access to the heroku deploy?
16:14:16  <airportyh>nope
16:16:02  <defunctzombie>airportyh: ok, I added you. I think you will get an email
16:16:10  <airportyh>cool
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16:19:53  <thlorenz>juliangruber: probably should ask in libuv if they do async IO for stdout/stderr like with any other file or if something is special
16:20:22  <thlorenz>juliangruber: remember from C that stdout stuff gets buffered and flushed later, while fprintf(stderr) gets flushed right away
16:20:28  <defunctzombie>iirc stdout is async but stderr is not.. but I could be wrong
16:20:50  <thlorenz>defunctzombie: cuz it gets buffered and flushed later right?
16:20:57  <defunctzombie>yea
16:21:41  <thlorenz>I mean in the end stdout goes to tty, so I don't know if it can really be non blocking
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16:25:40  <airportyh>defunctzombie: ah yes! my changes are live http://browserify-search.herokuapp.com/
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16:26:08  <defunctzombie>airportyh: nice
16:26:16  <defunctzombie>airportyh: tho I would make the search term a query arg
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16:26:40  <defunctzombie>q=search+terms+here
16:26:45  <defunctzombie>this is more typical than a path
16:26:51  <rowbit1>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 66, node10: 0]
16:27:21  <defunctzombie>airportyh: also, putting in "reactive" as a search term doesn't return reactive :)
16:27:44  <airportyh>defunctzombie: that's messed up
16:27:53  <airportyh>defunctzombie: but react does
16:28:02  <defunctzombie>airportyh: I agree it is messed up
16:28:10  <airportyh>must be the way they tokenize it in mongo
16:28:15  <defunctzombie>you are the keeper of the logic so I pass the baton to you :)
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16:28:36  <defunctzombie>I think we should open links in an iframe on the right
16:28:41  <airportyh>no it's there, just way down in the page
16:29:08  <airportyh>it's getting a bad score because it doesn't have github url linked
16:29:21  <defunctzombie>airportyh: I think we should give higher prority to exact module name matches
16:29:22  <defunctzombie>ah
16:29:52  <defunctzombie>for example a search for "array"
16:29:59  <defunctzombie>returns eventemitter2 as the first result
16:30:04  <defunctzombie>which seems to have nothing to do with array
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16:31:24  <airportyh>yeah, eventemitter2 also ranks high for test
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16:31:40  <airportyh>I guess their readme just has lots of content about everything
16:31:52  <defunctzombie>heh
16:32:05  <airportyh>I guess a more sophisticated approach would be a page-rank like thing
16:32:05  <defunctzombie>we should weigh the keywords and module description higher than the readme
16:32:17  <airportyh>it already does that
16:32:31  <airportyh>by having those higher in the search body
16:32:41  <airportyh>but not enough
16:32:59  <defunctzombie>ah
16:33:00  <airportyh>the thing is some readmes talk endlessly about how good their tests are
16:33:14  <airportyh>and so end up getting ranked for test
16:33:41  <defunctzombie>rofl
16:33:56  <defunctzombie>maybe we should only grab the first N words of the readme
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16:34:07  <defunctzombie>good readmes generally have a description first
16:34:12  <defunctzombie>and a few other details
16:34:15  <defunctzombie>test stuff comes later
16:34:18  <airportyh>yeah we could try that
16:34:21  <dguttman>and then there was the rise of module SEO
16:34:27  <defunctzombie>:D
16:34:43  <airportyh>:) page rank could weed these out too
16:35:06  <airportyh>like if it's dependent on by other test related modules?
16:35:10  <defunctzombie>I have a friend who use to work for google
16:35:14  <defunctzombie>doing machine learning
16:35:22  <dguttman>Sample TODO mvc framework. Tests, browserify, level, tests, tape, dat, test
16:35:23  <defunctzombie>I might be able to convince him to take a look at some things
16:35:46  <airportyh>that would be great
16:36:27  <airportyh>I have the python "collective intelligence" book next to me
16:37:30  <airportyh>I am happy that superagent gets rank 2nd for ajax
16:38:13  <airportyh>but jquery is like 15th for dom
16:39:01  <defunctzombie>haha
16:39:23  <defunctzombie>airportyh: I think a heart is misleading for dependencies
16:39:28  <defunctzombie>makes me think likes
16:39:33  <defunctzombie>airportyh: maybe use a chain icon
16:39:58  <defunctzombie>airportyh: search for "link" on icomoon
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17:10:44  <ogd>irc is where hackers talk when they don't want to be overheard https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2rGTXHvPCQ&feature=youtu.be
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17:11:31  <pfraze>speaking of has anybody decoded the backdoor yet?
17:11:31  <defunctzombie>ogd: YES
17:11:45  <defunctzombie>pfraze: yea
17:11:49  <defunctzombie>yesterday
17:11:54  <defunctzombie>it was finally decoded
17:12:15  <defunctzombie>I was alerted by my IRC bot that speaks leet
17:12:40  <defunctzombie>ok... we need a bot here that will turn everything we write into leet
17:13:05  <pfraze>I'd feel safer if we did
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19:10:00  <isaacs>ircretary: tell dominictarr pong2. maybe use email?
19:10:01  <ircretary>isaacs: I'll be sure to tell dominictarr
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19:58:56  <ogd>jlord: you should write a thing for github that lets me clone issues as a repository of markdown files from a github hosted repo url
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20:38:38  <airportyh>defunctzombie: so trying to browserify the github module will hang indefinitely
20:38:51  <defunctzombie>airportyh: ?
20:39:42  <airportyh>defunctzombie: https://gist.github.com/airportyh/10930576
20:39:59  <airportyh>:)
20:40:08  <defunctzombie>sounds like a browserify bug
20:40:26  <defunctzombie>probably something with streams
20:40:31  <defunctzombie>I blame all problems on streams
20:40:32  <airportyh>defunctzombie: if we spawn browserify then we can timeout and kill it
20:40:40  <airportyh>harder with in-process js
20:40:44  <defunctzombie>airportyh: yea, that might be smart
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20:40:58  <defunctzombie>make an issue about it on the tester
20:41:19  <defunctzombie>I want to move to spawning for some things anyway so this might be a good defensive reason to do so
20:41:35  <defunctzombie>substack: ^
20:41:44  <defunctzombie>substack: browserify hangs
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20:46:04  <airportyh>https://github.com/substack/node-browserify/issues/732
20:46:42  <airportyh>or I could just try to fix that :P
20:49:22  <substack>confirmed
20:53:07  <substack>airportyh: browser-resolve isn't calling its callback in require
20:54:55  <airportyh>substack: this one? https://github.com/defunctzombie/node-browser-resolve/blob/master/index.js#L109
20:56:22  <substack>packageFilter is stuck in a loop
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21:03:17  <airportyh>substack: narrowed to infinitely in this vicinity https://github.com/substack/node-resolve/blob/master/lib/async.js#L65-L106
21:06:57  <airportyh>so github's "main" is set to "."
21:19:44  <airportyh>substack: possibly fix is just remove this block https://github.com/substack/node-resolve/blob/master/lib/async.js#L94-L98 and replace with just line 97
21:22:21  <defunctzombie>possible fix is for that module's main to be fixed
21:22:36  <defunctzombie>and for npm to not allow such tom foolery
21:24:09  <airportyh>defunctzombie: but npm allows such tom foolery it seems
21:24:16  <defunctzombie>yes
21:24:35  <airportyh>defunctzombie: either it maps . to ./index, or it just fell back to ./index
21:24:53  <defunctzombie>tragically things are too lenient
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22:05:01  <airportyh>substack: https://github.com/substack/node-resolve/pull/41
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