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03:24:41  <defunctzombie>substack: what is the mad science you were working on?
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03:41:03  <substack>defunctzombie: http://github.com/substack/peermaps
03:41:38  <defunctzombie>huh
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05:28:30  <rowbit>substack, pkrumins: These encoders are STILL down: 162.242.164.84(dev-ie11-1)
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07:46:07  <rowbit>/!\ ATTENTION: (default-local) [email protected] successfully signed up for developer browserling plan ($20). Cash money! /!\
07:46:07  <rowbit>/!\ ATTENTION: (default-local) paid account successfully upgraded /!\
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08:02:14  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 8, free: 60]
08:04:32  <rowbit>substack, pkrumins: A developer is waiting in the queue for opera/19.0
08:13:32  <rowbit>substack, pkrumins: A developer is waiting in the queue for opera/19.0
08:17:02  <rowbit>substack, pkrumins: A developer is waiting in the queue for firefox/28.0
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08:37:32  <rowbit>substack, pkrumins: A developer is waiting in the queue for safari/5.1
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11:28:35  <rowbit>substack, pkrumins: These encoders are STILL down: 162.242.164.84(dev-ie11-1)
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15:23:25  <guybrush->hey guys do you know of some "trick" to disable the browser-history for mouse-buttons?
15:23:48  <guybrush->i wonder if that is possible maybe with pointerlock
15:24:27  <guybrush->basically i would like to enable the user to bind these buttons for a game
15:33:46  <rowbit>/!\ ATTENTION: (default-local) [email protected] successfully signed up for developer browserling plan ($20). Cash money! /!\
15:33:46  <rowbit>/!\ ATTENTION: (default-local) paid account successfully upgraded /!\
15:45:27  <juliangruber>what is some cheap but nutritious food you can make without a kitchen?
15:45:48  <juliangruber>or what would be some cheap but nutritious food to buy?
15:46:04  <juliangruber>my flat doesn't have a kitchen yet and eating out all the time is getting expensive :/
15:46:53  <juliangruber>guybrush-: maybe a combination of window.onclose and window.onkeydown
15:47:23  <guybrush->i tried this http://jordanhollinger.com/2012/06/08/disable-the-back-button-using-html5
15:48:08  <juliangruber>and the back button still moved you away?
15:48:14  <guybrush->no it works
15:48:27  <guybrush->but it feels really hacky
15:48:44  <juliangruber>sounds good to me^^
15:49:55  <guybrush->i guess i can do something with indexedDB or something, to avoid the hash in the url
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15:50:44  <guybrush->but really i think the pointerlock-api should provide this feature
15:50:48  <juliangruber>since you use html5 already
15:51:01  <juliangruber>you can just use the history api without changing the url
15:51:10  <guybrush->right
15:51:11  <juliangruber>history.pushState(null, '', '/')
15:51:27  <juliangruber>iirc that works
15:51:46  <guybrush->though i need to make the user aware that he disables the normal behavior
15:52:12  <guybrush->or just rething the whole control haha
15:52:13  <juliangruber>maybe a notification / popup / intorductory modal
15:52:17  <juliangruber>haha
15:52:18  <juliangruber>yeah
15:52:23  <juliangruber>i don't even have a mouse
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16:45:57  <pfraze>juliangruber: I usually go for sandwiches in that case
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17:28:40  <rowbit>substack, pkrumins: These encoders are STILL down: 162.242.164.84(dev-ie11-1)
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17:58:20  <juliangruber>pfraze: cool i'll add those to my repertoire
17:58:48  <juliangruber>substack: have you started working on hackable mobile phones?
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18:20:45  <Borune>hi all, I get: "timeout waiting to hear back from firefox/16.0" from ci.testling.com
18:21:43  <Borune>its a open repo npm mathfunctions
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18:22:48  <Borune>this also happens to chrome version 22 and 24 that i have taken out of the text
18:23:05  <Borune>mistype: test
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18:25:25  <substack>Borune: do you have a link to your repo on github?
18:27:50  <Borune>github.com/borune/mathFunctions
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18:34:37  <Borune>it passes the test in browserling FF16
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18:35:11  <jjjohnny>github.com/borune/mathFunctions
18:35:23  <jjjohnny> good 1 jjjohnny
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18:36:30  <jjjohnny>reminds me of https://github.com/NHQ/numerical
18:37:06  <jjjohnny>which i dont use
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18:48:01  <Borune>undestandable, there are better and better maintained repo
18:49:03  <jjjohnny>but who else has a subzero method?
18:50:07  <Borune>exactly, its the small diff that makes the diffrence
18:50:37  <Borune>reminds me of mk
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18:51:30  <jjjohnny>whats that?
18:53:31  <Borune>mortal kombat
18:54:02  <Borune>an old pc game :)
18:54:39  <jjjohnny>ah yes
18:55:02  <mmalecki>domanic: food?
19:02:14  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 5, free: 35]
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20:02:14  <rowbit>Daily usage stats: [developer: 6, free: 148]
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20:27:14  <jjjohnny>whats swift idc
20:31:31  <jjjohnny>wow a repl
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20:34:13  <terinjokes>jjjohnny: it's exciting for people who traditionally haven't had an repl
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20:42:03  <jjjohnny>terinjokes: "the latest reserach in programming languages"
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20:43:44  <jjjohnny>i prefer this swift language https://github.com/digego/extempore
20:43:58  <jjjohnny>the guy who made it name is ben swift :^P
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20:44:30  <pfraze>jjjohnny: hmmm that looks interesting
20:44:43  <jjjohnny>scheme + hot C compile injection for super fast real time shitz
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20:45:15  <jjjohnny>i would like something like that in JS
20:45:22  <jjjohnny>which i guess is what asm is kind of
20:45:51  <pfraze>could do that with workers
20:46:56  <pfraze>youd need a backend to watch the file and mark dirty, maybe use a websocket or ES to push the update signal
20:47:24  <jjjohnny>its like asm, which is like, I want this function to be precompiled to some faster shit
20:48:17  <jjjohnny>but the cool thing about extempore is that is comes with live audio and 3D GL enviroments
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20:48:54  <jjjohnny>which I am certain are faster/smoother than hacking the same in web audio and webGL
20:49:32  <pfraze>nahhhh couldnt be
20:49:48  <pfraze>:)
20:49:55  <jjjohnny>http://vimeo.com/52964510
20:50:17  <jjjohnny>but we do it for the share
20:50:34  <jjjohnny>still want a new browser
20:51:42  <pfraze>what would you put in it?
20:52:01  <jjjohnny>canvas and webGL and audio
20:52:31  <jjjohnny>and openSSL
20:52:35  <jjjohnny>and node
20:52:47  <pfraze>yeah, I think the canvas/webgl/audio thing will happen soon
20:53:04  <jjjohnny>fuck its so annoying i have to transport data over a server to save to my own hard drive
20:53:23  <jjjohnny>i dont agree with all this sandboxing
20:53:58  <jjjohnny>pfraze: one hopes
20:54:20  <pfraze>yeah. It's still a bit wonky -- tricky things like, how do you put text in the clip board since thats not exposed
20:54:34  <jjjohnny>yeah its slowing down web so much
20:54:38  <pfraze>famo.us was kind of a disaster too
20:55:09  <jjjohnny>thats why every dinky stupid mobile app can access cams, mic, hard drive, networking and all
20:55:18  <jjjohnny>yet the mobile browsers barely give you shit
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20:55:44  <jjjohnny>basically mobile got the big techs sidetracked, and the web browsers scoots along
20:56:00  <jjjohnny>muffhuckers
20:56:09  <pfraze>I dont know if it's really significant, but at least in mobile there's a review process for the apps
20:56:14  <jjjohnny>yeah im not touching famo.us
20:56:28  <jjjohnny>pfraze: that is also bad
20:56:40  <jjjohnny>thats just another level of patronizing sandbox behavior
20:56:43  <pfraze>yeah, but I can kind of justify the mindset for why mobile sites dont get the same privileges
20:57:05  <pfraze>sandboxing doesnt have to be bad, it just needs to be done better
20:57:09  <jjjohnny>i am not writing websites tho, i am writing real apps
20:57:12  <pfraze>yeah
20:57:46  <jjjohnny>meanwhile, the browser is such a constpated mess of regulations
20:58:34  <jjjohnny>argue for years about some CSS, abstract too much for us in networking and FS and AV
20:58:45  <jjjohnny>meanwhile, sure mobile have at it
20:58:49  <pfraze>wonder how feasible it would be to fork chromium and start doing what you're talking about
20:58:51  <jjjohnny>u get it all
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20:59:33  <jjjohnny>believe it or not, all my hopes for the performance i require in html-ish development, is with asm.js and firefox OS
20:59:49  <jjjohnny>perf, and nativity
20:59:56  <pfraze>is some hope there
21:00:02  <jjjohnny>and mozilla is fuck too weak
21:00:32  <jjjohnny>and spread too thin
21:00:57  <pfraze>you have to clap harder or the pixies die
21:01:36  <jjjohnny>pfraze: i been smacking my ass and hollaring and beating a drum
21:01:56  <jjjohnny>singing songs about bitcoin instead of writing apps for it
21:02:05  <pfraze>jjjohnny: hah keep up the good work
21:02:14  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 1, free: 47]
21:02:20  <jjjohnny>its called the hambone n yodel
21:03:46  <jjjohnny>thank you err,body for let n me croon my wishes n miseries in front of yas
21:04:52  <jjjohnny>hardcopy -h rant.txt
21:04:57  <jjjohnny>:^P
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21:24:39  <jjjohnny>the next browser has to give no fucks about legacy web
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21:25:27  <jjjohnny>nothing will ruin the next browser like needing to handle old browser shit
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21:27:30  <jjjohnny>isnt that what mobile apps did?
21:28:01  <mikolalysenko>maybe next web will use the bitcoin block chain or name coin instead of dns
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21:29:23  <jjjohnny>mikolalysenko: looks like its gonna use bit torrent
21:29:41  <jjjohnny>which plays well with cipherlinks
21:30:14  <mikolalysenko>hahaha
21:33:08  <mmalecki>domanic: https://github.com/zfsonlinux/zfs-auto-snapshot
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21:37:23  <pfraze>a blockchain for dns and cert pinning would interest me. That's what the okturtles guys are doing
21:37:31  <pfraze>cert distributing*
21:38:28  <pfraze>bittorrent would be good for files past a certain size, but I think the existing document exchange works fine for midsize, cacheable docs
21:39:03  <pfraze>offline mode just needs a runtime environment that does meaningful work without remote backends
21:39:41  <mikolalysenko>pfraze: bittorrent is even good for small files and indexing into big files
21:39:51  <mikolalysenko>actually I only learned this after watching mafintosh at webrebels
21:39:57  <pfraze>mikolalysenko: indexing into big files?
21:40:01  <mikolalysenko>you can actually seek around in bittorrent files!
21:40:05  <mikolalysenko>yeah, it is just a big hash table
21:40:06  <pfraze>ohhh huh
21:40:21  <mikolalysenko>bittorrent files are totally usable as things like indices or database stuff!
21:40:49  <pfraze>isn't bittorrent immutable?
21:40:52  <mikolalysenko>yes
21:40:57  <mikolalysenko>the one drawback
21:41:03  <pfraze>could you exchange new seeds to solve that?
21:41:11  <mikolalysenko>maybe
21:41:29  <mikolalysenko>but it would be great for serving static content
21:41:44  <mikolalysenko>pretty much anything you use a cdn for could be done better using bittorrent + a few seeders I think
21:41:50  <mikolalysenko>though there might also be security issues...
21:42:05  <mikolalysenko>I don't think bittorrent is robust against a sybil attack, but in practice it doesn't seem to matter too much
21:42:34  <pfraze>no?
21:43:20  <pfraze>is that just because nobody does that attack?
21:43:29  <mikolalysenko>no, it is just hard to defend against
21:43:50  <mikolalysenko>bittorrent is byzantine fault tolerant, as long as a majority of nodes agree and are not broken
21:44:02  <mikolalysenko>but it is not robust against malicious attacks that spawn lots of spurious nodes
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21:44:18  <pfraze>yeah, I'm wondering why you think the sybil attack isnt an issue
21:44:28  <mikolalysenko>oh, it is an issue
21:44:34  <mikolalysenko>but only against a malicious adversary
21:45:02  <pfraze>you can only control for that with guaranteed peers, right?
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21:45:17  <mikolalysenko>bitcoin secures against it using proof-of-work
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21:45:30  <mikolalysenko>it replaces majority node consensus with majority compute consensus
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21:46:10  <pfraze>could the blockchain name/cert service mitigate the bit-torrent sybil attack?
21:46:40  <mikolalysenko>sybil attack could still cause denial of service
21:46:49  <mikolalysenko>but at least it could prevent malicious data from sneaking in
21:47:13  <mikolalysenko>though if you stored the hash signatures in a namecoin/blockchain structure maybe it could work
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21:47:32  <pfraze>a DoS would involve flooding the network with bad bit-torrent entries?
21:47:32  <mikolalysenko>at least I half convinced myself this seemed alright on the plane ride back, but I could be wrong
21:48:05  <mikolalysenko>DoS would be involve connecting with a bunch of fake peers and then sabotaging the hash contents
21:48:32  <pfraze>ok, so the fake peers couldnt be dismissed easily enough with a good verification like the blockchain?
21:48:53  <pfraze>I may not be thinking precisely enough about how the blockchain would interact with bit-torrent
21:48:56  <mikolalysenko>well, what you would do is store the hash signatures and version history in the block chain
21:48:59  <mikolalysenko>which is secure
21:49:08  <mikolalysenko>and then use bittorrent to serve and distribute the content
21:49:32  <pfraze>bittorrent has to announce seeders though, right?
21:49:38  <mikolalysenko>basically each block chain entry would be a torrent/magnet link
21:49:54  <mikolalysenko>you need a few peers to start from, but once you have that you can connect to more
21:51:28  <pfraze>maybe I misunderstand the sybil attack here - I was thinking it would be a flood of false peers which would be used to claim majority authority
21:51:40  <mikolalysenko>yeah, that is how it would work
21:51:57  <mikolalysenko>but bitcoin is robust against that
21:52:09  <pfraze>yeah, so the blockchain could be used to disprove the false peers, yeah?
21:52:19  <mikolalysenko>yeah
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21:53:06  <pfraze>ok
21:53:12  <mikolalysenko>though it probably wouldn't work for bittorrent
21:53:19  <pfraze>no?
21:53:26  <mikolalysenko>I think you could still mess up locating good peers if you had enough sybils in the network
21:53:55  <pfraze>bittorrent's advantage over straight HTTP is the distributed hosting, right?
21:54:13  <mikolalysenko>yeah, you get more capacity as you get more users
21:54:30  <mikolalysenko>so if your page/app gets slashdotted you don't crash and instead expand automatically
21:54:48  <mikolalysenko>of course this would only be for hosting static content, you get no advantage for dynamic content
21:54:54  <pfraze>yeah
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21:55:52  <pfraze>perhaps there's an algorithm hybrid, where the original host maintains the peerlist
21:56:20  <pfraze>the webrtc cdn thing did that, I think
21:56:34  <pfraze>the guys that got bought out by yahoo
21:57:06  <mikolalysenko>never heard of that, but sounds interesting
21:57:21  <mikolalysenko>do you have a link?
21:57:25  <pfraze>let me look
21:57:33  <pfraze>https://peercdn.com/
21:58:32  <mikolalysenko>oh! that's feross!
21:58:39  <mikolalysenko>wow! I am so clueless about this whole space
21:59:16  <pfraze>oh huh, I didnt realize you were part of that feross
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22:00:34  <pfraze>well this all sounds good to me, let's start web3.0
22:02:14  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 6, free: 21]
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22:47:15  <mikolalysenko>check it out, 3D delaunay triangulation: http://mikolalysenko.github.io/delaunay-triangulate/3d.html
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23:09:53  <substack>chrisdickinson: x="y z" doesn't work in cssauron
23:10:03  <substack>in an attribute selector I mean
23:10:08  <substack>div[x="y z"]
23:10:22  <substack>the tokenizer splits on whitespace from inside of a quoted string
23:10:49  <chrisdickinson>boo, will fix. sorry about that!
23:11:02  <substack>node -e "require('./tokenizer')().on('data', console.log).end('*[msg=\"gary busey\"]')"
23:11:06  <substack>is what I was using to test it
23:11:21  <substack>I'll send you my failing test case
23:13:48  <substack>https://github.com/chrisdickinson/cssauron/pull/3
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23:15:33  <chrisdickinson>Rad, thanks! I'm without a working computer till tomorrow but will fix ASAP after that
23:16:21  <substack>no rush!
23:16:37  <substack>I'm just about ready to switch trumpet over to using html-select which uses cssauron
23:16:42  <substack>everything should be really solid now
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23:28:00  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 1, free: 34]
23:28:44  <rowbit>substack, pkrumins: These encoders are STILL down: 162.242.164.84(dev-ie11-1)
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23:35:28  <jjjohnny>WHERE WEER DID U GO, BEER THAT DISAPPEARED?
23:35:28  <LOUDBOT>EXCUSE ME SIR, SIR, WHY ARE YOU DRESSED AS A FURRY. SIR!
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