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| <trungl-bot> | Tree closed by [email protected]: Tree is closed (Automatic: "Check" on http://build.chromium.org/p/client.v8/builders/V8%20Win64/builds/3151 "V8 Win64" from ae0bc41635759d67dbb4bc7dfdec2dce48e1b098: [email protected]) |
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| <StephenLynx> | hey, have anyone considered not using svn for building V8 dependencies? |
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| 13:17:05
| <caitp> | i don't think svn is used anymore for any of them |
| 13:18:31
| <StephenLynx> | Well, I just had to install svn to be able to run "make dependencies". Cloned it friday. |
| 13:19:29
| <caitp> | you must be using an old version |
| 13:19:51
| <StephenLynx> | default branch, cloned friday. |
| 13:20:03
| <caitp> | make dependencies no longer does anything, have to use depot_tools now |
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| 13:22:15
| <StephenLynx> | branch master, cloned from github.com/v8/v8.git Last commit was on december 2014. |
| 13:22:26
| <caitp> | yeah, that's old |
| 13:22:34
| <caitp> | the github mirror is v8/v8-git-mirror now |
| 13:22:38
| <StephenLynx> | ah |
| 13:22:40
| <StephenLynx> | ok |
| 13:23:59
| <caitp> | https://chromium.googlesource.com/v8/v8.git is the main upstream repo, but it shouldn't make too much of a difference |
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| <trungl-bot> | Tree closed by [email protected]: Tree is closed (Automatic: "compile" on http://build.chromium.org/p/client.v8/builders/Android%20Builder/builds/4131 "Android Builder" from 39c31da2142ab0fca9dae279b9e59cd4951a1982: [email protected],[email protected],[email protected]) |
| 13:26:47
| <StephenLynx> | ok, using master of v8-git-mirror, should it be alright? |
| 13:27:23
| <caitp> | yeah, it's probably a few hours behind at most |
| 13:32:28
| <trungl-bot> | Tree opened by [email protected]: Tree is open |
| 13:37:26
| <Getty> | wowwowoow we are talking? ;) |
| 13:37:35
| <Getty> | dont shock the poor users! |
| 13:38:00
| <caitp> | :> |
| 13:42:39
| <Getty> | V8 is the btw the coolest shit since slice bread, its just not know yet by the others |
| 13:46:11
| <esas> | yeah and it's pretty straight forward to integrate, I like it :) |
| 13:47:21
| <Getty> | yeah well "straight forward to integrate" is always a bit vague statement somehow |
| 13:47:38
| <Getty> | i mean the Perl XS implementation of it, is brutal and its based on the OLD UNREFACTORED v8 |
| 13:47:39
| <esas> | haha true |
| 13:47:49
| <StephenLynx> | so far I wish it wouldn't rely so much on google's stuff for dependencies. |
| 13:47:52
| <Getty> | so i need to make that new, and i didnt made the first implementation, i have no idea what i do! |
| 13:47:54
| <Getty> | but i want it there |
| 13:47:55
| <esas> | it was easy for me in C++ at least :) |
| 13:48:05
| <Getty> | can i trigger you for help? ;) |
| 13:49:16
| <esas> | maybe, it was mostly just copy n paste to get it working from what I remember |
| 13:49:24
| <esas> | I'm dug into CEF at the moment |
| 13:50:43
| <Getty> | yeah i am still not near that point, but i want the newest v8 |
| 13:51:04
| <esas> | not as easy to integrate from what I've gathered thus far |
| 13:51:04
| <Getty> | right now it works fine with debian v8 (oldstable) and the perl module |
| 13:51:08
| <Getty> | that makes it AT LEAST usable |
| 13:51:09
| <esas> | (cef, not newest v8) |
| 13:51:13
| <Getty> | what COULD help |
| 13:51:16
| <Getty> | would be something independent |
| 13:51:25
| <Getty> | i want a v8 running that i can inject with API |
| 13:51:29
| <Getty> | that would clear the topic up 100% |
| 13:51:39
| <Getty> | best with socket |
| 13:51:53
| <StephenLynx> | http://blog.wolfire.com/2010/01/Choosing-a-scripting-language this guy has some critics to V8. |
| 13:52:16
| <StephenLynx> | "I found that it is quite difficult to expose C++ functions to the V8 JavaScript engine -- there is no established Luabind equivalent, so I had to create a much more low-level wrapper than I did for Lua. This is not so hard for simple functions and variables, but it would be very difficult to expose complicated classes and member functions." |
| 13:52:16
| <Getty> | he first needs to come up with an alternative |
| 13:52:26
| <Getty> | v8 is right now the only safe environment available |
| 13:52:35
| <Getty> | ;) |
| 13:52:39
| <Getty> | aehm |
| 13:52:47
| <Getty> | why i said environment variable? |
| 13:52:52
| <Getty> | i meant only safe scripting environment |
| 13:53:05
| <Getty> | the general idea i follow here around v8: make it cloud, make it cloud, make it cloud |
| 13:53:14
| <Getty> | offer a service, offer v8 as scripting for the service ON THE SERVICE |
| 13:53:24
| <Getty> | make lots of $$$ |
| 13:53:30
| <StephenLynx> | hm |
| 13:53:46
| <StephenLynx> | I like it because its fast :v |
| 13:54:00
| <StephenLynx> | and js syntax if very close to C syntax. |
| 13:54:14
| <Getty> | but thats all something thats personal |
| 13:54:17
| <StephenLynx> | and script mode takes away js' insanity in most part. |
| 13:54:20
| <Getty> | the relevant point here is: |
| 13:54:21
| <Getty> | No IO |
| 13:54:26
| <StephenLynx> | as so is making lots of money. |
| 13:54:28
| <Getty> | i can give ANYONE access to my local V8 |
| 13:54:37
| <Getty> | and i dont need to fear of them doing something bad |
| 13:54:41
| <Getty> | they _CANT_ do something bad |
| 13:54:53
| <StephenLynx> | you could just create an use without privileged and grant them SSH acess. |
| 13:55:00
| <Getty> | its not like i need to care about security, or watch and wait for security problems, there are none by concept |
| 13:55:02
| <StephenLynx> | an user* |
| 13:55:18
| <Getty> | v8 allows total freedom on that and all others cant |
| 13:55:27
| <Getty> | LUA has also the proble, |
| 13:55:32
| <Getty> | you cant make an IO free LUA |
| 13:55:34
| <Getty> | its not possible |
| 13:55:40
| <Getty> | you have to take care of security with all LUA all the time |
| 13:55:46
| <Getty> | (i talked with LUA expert) |
| 13:56:29
| <StephenLynx> | strict mode takes away* |
| 13:56:34
| <StephenLynx> | noticed a typo. |
| 14:01:26
| <Getty> | important is that much more people use it |
| 14:01:31
| <Getty> | i made a complete ContentManagement SYstem |
| 14:01:34
| <Getty> | wait i can show you some doc |
| 14:01:41
| <caitp> | for IO, node/iojs are good embedders to look at |
| 14:01:53
| <caitp> | pretty straight forward implementation of IO bindings there |
| 14:02:03
| <Getty> | https://sycontent.de/help/rules sorry for the outdated cert ;) i am lazy |
| 14:02:14
| <Getty> | we talk here SPECIFIC about NOT IO |
| 14:02:19
| <Getty> | if i have IO i can use a serious language |
| 14:02:29
| <Getty> | node people are pretty stupid for just being lazy to learn a real language |
| 14:02:37
| <Getty> | the point of v8 is that i can give access to anything to anybody |
| 14:02:42
| <Getty> | node kills that purpose directly |
| 14:02:53
| <Getty> | if the user has IO then i have to think about security |
| 14:02:53
| <Getty> | A LOT |
| 14:02:56
| <Getty> | like A LOT A LOT |
| 14:03:06
| <Getty> | like 95% of the project investment goes into securing the user in his environment |
| 14:03:07
| <StephenLynx> | no, node people are stupid because they are web developers. |
| 14:03:12
| <Getty> | hey ;) |
| 14:03:20
| <Getty> | i am one of the good web developers, dont say it so evil |
| 14:03:26
| <Getty> | but yeah you are right, 99% are retards |
| 14:03:28
| <Getty> | 99.9% |
| 14:03:45
| <Getty> | the retards in my job area are strong |
| 14:03:46
| <Getty> | very very strong |
| 14:04:27
| <caitp> | it's not very nice to call people retards mate |
| 14:04:48
| <StephenLynx> | unless they don't have any mental disorder, it doesnt matter. |
| 14:05:04
| <StephenLynx> | unless they have* |
| 14:05:05
| <Getty> | oh sorry, the retards shouldnt be brought in context with those no-brain-humans ;) yes |
| 14:05:28
| <Getty> | retards at least try their best |
| 14:05:49
| <Getty> | but some web developers...... unbelievable |
| 14:06:04
| <Getty> | whatever, the point is that this security element is crucial and thats why v8 will get much more attention in the future |
| 14:06:11
| <Getty> | think about the following and that is something that you should keep in mind: |
| 14:06:27
| <StephenLynx> | my problem with web developers is that they have just used training wheels they whole life and they become so oblivious with what they don't know that they start thinking they actually know stuff. |
| 14:06:30
| <Getty> | you hire.... a developer..... to make your script on your service, instead of hiring a developer that gives you an environment first to make his code |
| 14:06:38
| <Getty> | stephenlynx: not all of them |
| 14:06:42
| <StephenLynx> | so you get some gems like "I need a framework for http in my http runtime environment. |
| 14:06:44
| <Getty> | stephenlynx: but 99.9% |
| 14:06:48
| <Getty> | hahahahha |
| 14:06:53
| <Getty> | you talk about node, yes? |
| 14:06:54
| <Getty> | ;-) |
| 14:06:57
| <Getty> | node people are 100% |
| 14:07:09
| <Getty> | there is not 1 guy i would say is a serious developer who says "i must use node on my server" |
| 14:07:15
| <Getty> | i didnt found one yet |
| 14:07:25
| <StephenLynx> | you are not that further because you don't know io.js. |
| 14:07:41
| <Getty> | yeah i heard about it |
| 14:07:45
| <Getty> | what is it? like even more IO in Node? |
| 14:08:09
| <StephenLynx> | no, its a fork that have greatly surpassed node in every aspect. |
| 14:08:16
| <caitp> | it's just a fork of node with more up to date v8 revisions |
| 14:09:01
| <Getty> | ah ok |
| 14:09:19
| <Getty> | so the node people are even the stupid people inside the bubble of JS fanatics? ;-) |
| 14:09:24
| <Getty> | thats cool |
| 14:09:48
| <StephenLynx> | no, they are just the regular web developers. |
| 14:09:51
| <caitp> | got a bit of a judgemental attitude man, take it easy =) |
| 14:10:17
| <StephenLynx> | I honestly haven't found much difference between them and any other web developer. |
| 14:10:32
| <Getty> | hahaha ;) |
| 14:10:39
| <StephenLynx> | they cling to useless bloat, they don't know the basics, they see themselves as rockstarts. |
| 14:10:42
| <StephenLynx> | rockstars* |
| 14:10:47
| <Getty> | hey man i am a web developer ;) but not by choice its just what i get |
| 14:11:04
| <Getty> | but i did big things with lots of backend and lots of scripts thta would never run in "web languages" |
| 14:11:21
| <StephenLynx> | I do back-end development, but honestly I don't consider myself a web-developer. |
| 14:11:28
| <StephenLynx> | is just one of the things I end up doing. |
| 14:13:16
| <StephenLynx> | when people do nothing but web development, it can't be helped, all the available tools are training wheels and it has a community that is resistant to learning. |
| 14:13:44
| <StephenLynx> | they rather add a dependency than writing a half dozen of intelligent lines. |
| 14:14:33
| <StephenLynx> | if you are really that different than every other web developer, you shouldn't portrait yourself as one. |
| 14:15:16
| <StephenLynx> | btw, isn't this the official v8 channel? the C and C++ channels on freenode are pretty serious, but this doesn't seem to be. |
| 14:16:16
| <caitp> | it is, but it's not as active as #jsapi on irc.mozilla.org for example |
| 14:16:41
| <caitp> | google has a sort of different collaboration strategy, not as irc-focused as moz |
| 14:16:47
| <StephenLynx> | I see. |
| 14:16:57
| <Getty> | stephenlynx: hahahaha you are one ;) |
| 14:17:03
| <StephenLynx> | I am what? |
| 14:17:24
| <Getty> | web developer ;9 if you are a backend developer who delivers the stuff for the frontend guy |
| 14:17:29
| <Getty> | then you are already sucked in deeper as you think |
| 14:17:36
| <Getty> | your brain already destabilize |
| 14:17:38
| <Getty> | ;-) |
| 14:17:40
| <StephenLynx> | As I said, its just one of many things that I do. |
| 14:17:58
| <StephenLynx> | I have done desktop development, ios dev, game dev |
| 14:18:08
| <StephenLynx> | now I work with android too |
| 14:18:27
| <StephenLynx> | you don't become a mexican because you ate a taco. |
| 14:18:48
| <StephenLynx> | ah, and first of all: I didn't started developing for web. |
| 14:18:56
| <StephenLynx> | it was the last thing that I started doing. |
| 14:18:57
| <caitp> | as far as most recruiters are concerned, you do |
| 14:19:15
| <Getty> | yeah |
| 14:19:17
| <Getty> | what he says ;) |
| 14:19:30
| <Getty> | if you have 1 web project in your timeline, you are a mexican ;) aehm you know ;) |
| 14:19:34
| <StephenLynx> | and thats why developers don't give a hoot about what recruiters think. |
| 14:19:48
| <StephenLynx> | or HR or managers. |
| 14:19:50
| <Getty> | noone gives |
| 14:20:11
| <StephenLynx> | so you should see why it doesn't matter to me what a recruiter thinks. |
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| 14:29:37
| <Getty> | it doesnt care for anyone ;) but the problem is the reflection, many people are seen web developer just cause they solved once web problems |
| 14:29:50
| <Getty> | while its like NORMAL for a developer at least once to solve a web problem, if its his own for the sake of doing it yourself |
| 14:30:00
| <Getty> | but then the varity is big |
| 14:30:23
| <Getty> | i am right now converting a customer project 15 year old perl legacy (which btw runs fine with the most recent perl hehe) |
| 14:30:37
| <Getty> | he just did this one project, he is a pure web developer in that sense ;) |
| 14:30:49
| <Getty> | but he never did anything else, so... yeah he uses NOTHING ;) |
| 14:31:07
| <Getty> | but he makes better code as most other web developer i have seen ;-) |
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| <trungl-bot> | Tree closed by [email protected]: Tree is closed (Automatic: "Mjsunit" on http://build.chromium.org/p/client.v8/builders/V8%20Linux64%20GC%20Stress%20-%20custom%20snapshot/builds/129 "V8 Linux64 GC Stress - custom snapshot" from 462ffa1dfa0ab3a851ea0294470d1ed7ed12dd56: [email protected],[email protected]) |
| 15:27:24
| <StephenLynx> | got it to build. it wasnt that hard. I still wish it wouldn't depend on that weird google thing. |
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| <StephenLynx> | ok, it is built. Can I copy and paste just the v8 part into my project? |
| 20:49:06
| <StephenLynx> | how trivial is to do that? I believe io.js and node have done that. |
| 20:51:38
| <StephenLynx> | it seems I don't need the out directory, it isn't on the io.js project. |
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| <trungl-bot> | Tree closed by [email protected]: Tree is closed (maintenance) |
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| <caitp> | StephenLynx, io.js and node use a customized gyp build |
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| <caitp> | the build system is wired up specifically for their uses |
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| <StephenLynx> | hm. |
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| <caitp> | all the embedders kinda have to do that |
| 20:54:40
| <StephenLynx> | I just used make ia32 |
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| <caitp> | you can probably link with it just fine |
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